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Saradomin and the Lore Corner

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Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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I noticed the Lore Corner posting had some rather juicy tidbits on Saradomin, so I thought I would collect them for discussion (spoilers ahead):

Mod Stu's answers:

"Sky Jexel said:
5. How much freedom does Saradomin give his followers to choose how they should live their lives?"

"Plenty. While there are plenty in the church that might wish to micromanage the daily lives of individual followers, Saradomin has to focus on the bigger picture, for the good of all."

Sky Jexel said:
"6. Saradomin claims after Sliske's Endgame that he will create a utopia for all races. Would he strive to create a society where races such as demons or Mahjarrat could live in peace with humans?

Yes. Why would he discriminate over race?"

"Sky Jexel said:
7. What exactly was the sentient race other than the icyene that was native to New Domina"

It was very very bad. The darkness to the icyene's light, the devils to their angels. They could not be reasoned with; to pursue peace and diplomacy would be the icyene's undoing. The only option was to purge the corruption to prevent it from spreading."

"Sky Jexel said:
8. Did the Temple Knights in the Fourth and Fifth Ages really communicate directly with Saradomin?"

"So they claim."

"Shadoliax said:
15) Will we ever learn why Saradomin decided to destroy Askroth?"

"The pieces of the puzzle are available to you. You need only fit them together."

23-Jan-2017 01:43:02

Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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“Chaos Lupus said:
3.) In what sense is Adrasteia Saradomin's daughter? Was it a similar situation to Tumeken/Elidinis/Icthlarin/Amascut, did Saradomin find another way around it, has she somehow survived since the time before Saradomin's ascension?

4.) Is Adrasteia a demigod, human, or some sort of hybrid with another race?”

“So, I am going to be deliberately vague here because these questions are better answered with story reveals than on a forum post.

Adrasteia is Saradomin's daughter, he her father. He loves her just as any father would love their own daughter. She is the single most important thing to Saradomin, above all other things, even his own path to power.

Adrasteia was NOT born on Teragard.

Adrasteia is not a god, but she is perhaps more than mortal.

Should be suitably vague but give a few answers. I leave the rest of the discussion to the lore forums.”

Mod Rowley:

“Sky Jexel said: 8. Did the Temple Knights in the Fourth and Fifth Ages really communicate directly with Saradomin?”

“8. Someone instructed the Temple Knights how to construct the Salve barrier (during the Fourth Age), though that could have been instructions left for them (by Saradomin) and need not suggest direct communication with him.”

Mod Jack:

“Original message details are unavailable.
And how does Saradomin view the Zarosian genocide and his role in it?”

“Saradomin doesn't see it as a genocide at all. He sees it as a rightful and just conquest of the old empire, and the conversion of its people to a more wise and just ruler, i.e. him. Without the interference of Zamorak, Azzanadra, Nex and the other successor Zarosians, not to mention Bandos, this would have proceeded largely peacefully so he holds them entirely responsible.”

Mod Raven:

“Pizzahatt1 said:
- In Hero's Welcome, Kalibath was interrogating a White Knight about the whereabouts of Saradomin's "weakness". Was he talking about Adrasteia?”

“Yes.”

23-Jan-2017 01:43:15

Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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So, with this new bunch of lore, what draws the most interest to you?

The level of freedom of Saradominists? The lack of Racial Discrimination? The Icyene’s enemies? Saradomin’s connection to the Temple Knights? The info on Adrasteia? Saradomin’s (unmet) desire for a more peaceful conquest of the Zarosian Empire?

Would love to hear what you guys think.

23-Jan-2017 01:43:21

Hazeel

Hazeel

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Adrasteia was very interesting. The fact that Saradomin actually puts her above his path to power is both surprising and pleasing to hear. Some things needed a bit more explanation though...like Saradomin giving his followers freedom to live their lives. When he kills someone in a horrible painful and humiliating way simply for speaking out their disagreement and says she should tell people how to live their lives...I want a little more detail on how they are "free". Runescape doesn't need a hero...it needs a villain. An all encompassing force of evil that will remain ever-threatening and use chaos to make the peoples of Gielinor tolerate each other, grow strong together, and fight side by side against this evil. I am that villain.

23-Jan-2017 01:58:48

Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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Hazeel said:
Adrasteia was very interesting. The fact that Saradomin actually puts her above his path to power is both surprising and pleasing to hear. Some things needed a bit more explanation though...like Saradomin giving his followers freedom to live their lives. When he kills someone in a horrible painful and humiliating way simply for speaking out their disagreement and says she should tell people how to live their lives...I want a little more detail on how they are "free".


Yeah, Saradomin's love for his daughter above all else is a really nice humanizing moment for the human-born god.

If you're referring to Garlandia in the second bit, I'm pretty sure the reason for that is explained here by Mod Stu:

"Sky Jexel said:
7. What exactly was the sentient race other than the icyene that was native to New Domina"

"It was very very bad. The darkness to the icyene's light, the devils to their angels. They could not be reasoned with; to pursue peace and diplomacy would be the icyene's undoing. The only option was to purge the corruption to prevent it from spreading."

It fits with what Saradomin said on the incident in Sliske's Endgame, that he heard her words, and was enticed by such words of peace, and wished to follow them, but knew that if the Icyene did nothing, they would be destroyed. While the example he had to make disgusted him and was cruel, it unified the Icyene and, according to Mod Stu's response above, saved their lives.

If you were referring to something else, forgive my confusion.

23-Jan-2017 02:44:33

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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Is it just me, or are these answers kind of contradictory.

Mewzard said:
Sky Jexel said:
"6. Saradomin claims after Sliske's Endgame that he will create a utopia for all races. Would he strive to create a society where races such as demons or Mahjarrat could live in peace with humans?

Yes. Why would he discriminate over race?"

"Sky Jexel said:
7. What exactly was the sentient race other than the icyene that was native to New Domina"

It was very very bad. The darkness to the icyene's light, the devils to their angels. They could not be reasoned with; to pursue peace and diplomacy would be the icyene's undoing. The only option was to purge the corruption to prevent it from spreading."


Hey, he doesn't discriminate over race, but every member of that other race was impossible to incorporate into his empire.

I get that it's supposed to be him judging them based on their actions (though I question how that applies to every last member (*cough*children*cough*) of a race that is presumably sentient), but if a being's range of behavior is predetermined by their race it kind of blurs the line between discriminating by race and discriminating by behavior. And if their range of behavior isn't predetermined by race, killing absolutely all of them off/reducing their population below what can sustain the species is kind of extreme/unnecessary/wasteful.

Or am I just missing something?

23-Jan-2017 03:40:12

Lego Miester
Jul Member 2019

Lego Miester

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I'm interested by that other race that Saradomin purged. Whether they were indeed beyond reason or Saradomin simply judged them beyond reason are two very different things.

As for his daughter being "his weakness" I'm curious what everyone would use that for given the opportunity. I'd probably try to befriend her to try to exploit the emotional weak point and get her to appeal to Saradomin's humanity and reason with him. Like Saradomin, maybe that's not the nicest thing to do, but it needs to be done.
Headcanon Haven, where everything is made up and the points don't matter.
OSRS Lore: Xeric

23-Jan-2017 03:56:39

Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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Lego Miester said:
I'm interested by that other race that Saradomin purged. Whether they were indeed beyond reason or Saradomin simply judged them beyond reason are two very different things.

As for his daughter being "his weakness" I'm curious what everyone would use that for given the opportunity. I'd probably try to befriend her to try to exploit the emotional weak point and get her to appeal to Saradomin's humanity and reason with him. Like Saradomin, maybe that's not the nicest thing to do, but it needs to be done.


Well, I asked Mod Stu, we'll see what he says.

But given it was a quote direct from the writer of Saradomin's big quest, I'm inclined to think he's a reliable source for this info (if it were a character in game, that'd be easier to question).

Working with Adrasteia to help better Saradomin would be ideal.

Interesting that she's not a god, but might be more than mortal...wonder what that means.

23-Jan-2017 04:08:32 - Last edited on 23-Jan-2017 04:09:01 by Mewzard

Mewzard
May Member 2019

Mewzard

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Well, Mod Stu responded:

"Mewzard 4h4 hours ago

@JagexStu Were there any good people among the opposing group of the Icyene on their home world? And if so, what happened to them?"

"Mod Stu
‏@JagexStu

@Mewzard Some are calling it genocide. It was more like eradicating a plague, or extermination of a lethal swarm. It was kill or be killed."

The description of a "plague" or "swarm" is interesting. He said before they couldn't be reasoned with...This certainly raises some questions as to what kind of creatures these were that they're compared to such things.

23-Jan-2017 08:17:38

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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Mewzard said:
The description of a "plague" or "swarm" is interesting. He said before they couldn't be reasoned with...This certainly raises some questions as to what kind of creatures these were that they're compared to such things.


If they can't possibly be reasoned with, I question why Saradomin makes the distinction between animals (skypouncers and other 'creatures') and this unknown race.

Because, again:

Hguoh said:
if a being's range of behavior is predetermined by their race it kind of blurs the line between discriminating by race and discriminating by behavior. And if their range of behavior isn't predetermined by race, killing absolutely all of them off/reducing their population below what can sustain the species is kind of extreme/unnecessary/wasteful.


Unless, of course, they aren't sentient. But if that is the case, than by what metric is he classifying them as natives and not one of New Domina's other 'creatures.'

23-Jan-2017 13:35:11

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