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Desperate Times discussion?

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Dennorak

Dennorak

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- Orthen sounds really cool, I wonder what exactly lives there? Is it abandoned? Dragonkin donít seem to have the population to hold a city in its traditional form?

- So exactly how strong is Kerapac now? He has the staff and absorbed the power of the needle... making him extremely danersous.

- Finally, Kerapac has a ton of potential to be a really cool villain, dare I say the best RuneScape has had? Looking forward to where he goes.
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13-May-2019 23:53:27

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Well, evacuating all of the beings of Gielinor to other realms would be a massive endeavor. Opening portals between realms for mass transportation would take vast amounts of power that the Gods themselves don't even have. While sacrificing Gielinor COULD be necessary, I don't think it should be plan A. You should be pushing to save Gielinor, and if you need to sacrifice it you do so as a last resort. I think Kerapac is just blinded by his anger/lust for revenge after what Jas did to his people, that he is willing to make that sacrifice from the get go.
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14-May-2019 03:42:27

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Hazeel said:
Why...the hell...did anyone entertain Seren's plan? To call it childish and naive is being generous. It's idiotic and shows and is no less egotistical than Zaros.

Kerapac is actually being reasonable about this, and I stand by the fact that Gielinor's truly is a stagnant hellhole for just about anyone unless you're Bandos and want something that will attract war. It's an easy choice to sacrifice it for the rest of the universe.

It's funny, really, how easy it'd be for everyone to get more or less what they want. Just remove Gielinor. Go back to their homes. Saradomin lives in his world of pure order and stagnation, Zamorak lives in his cutthroat world of chaos, the Bandosians can endlessly wage war with each other, and the elves can slowly drive the aviansie extinct as they try to live together and go deaf from their horrid squawking.

The issue is even if we wanted to leave Gielinor, mass transportation would be extremely difficult without an outside power source. The two mass teleportation stop gielinor weíve seen were powered by Hostilius and Loarnab, two beings with god like strength and both essentially died in the process.
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14-May-2019 06:49:10

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Hazeel said:
Dennorak said:
The issue is even if we wanted to leave Gielinor, mass transportation would be extremely difficult without an outside power source. The two mass teleportation stop gielinor weíve seen were powered by Hostilius and Loarnab, two beings with god like strength and both essentially died in the process.


That was from one side of the multi-verse to the other. Not everyone needs to go that far...and nobody needs to go that far all at once. There's also the World Gate as an option.

I can't really see the World Gate as being a viable option, it's big enough to maybe fit one or two people at a time. Opening portals to new realms for Gods to travel alone seems to be doable. Doing it and trying to transport the population of an entire realm seems to be much more difficult. Not to mention the gods all came to Gielinor for a reason, this is the best planet out there. You'd rather find a way to try to defend it than just immediately concede it. Kerapac's plan should be more of a last resort than your primary plan.
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14-May-2019 07:19:03 - Last edited on 14-May-2019 07:20:22 by Dennorak

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Well Guthix didn't bring everyone here, several races arrived in bulk with other gods, Zamorak brought most of the Demons, Zaros brought several races such as Vampyres, Demons etc. Saradomin brought the Icyene (and probably a good chunk of humans), Armadyl brought the aviansie, Bandos brought... well pretty much every typical Bandosian race etc.

I agree a peaceful Gielinor, completely peaceful, is a dream rather than something that can be turned into a reality, but Gielinor itself offers the most potential of any of the worlds. Yes, Gielinor has a history of being a war ravaged world, but there is a reason all of the Gods fight over Gielinor and not Infernus, Hallow, or Terragarde. This planet is the Elder Gods perfect creation, and one we shouldn't sacrifice readily without trying other options.

I think that's my main issue with Kerapac's plan. He is prepared to make that sacrifice immediately without testing other options. He certainly has a somewhat... sympathetic motive? While sacrificing an entire planet is a horrible thing to do, the prospect of saving all other planets is a noble one. I just think sacrificing Gielinor should be a last resort, not something you jump into.
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14-May-2019 15:54:28 - Last edited on 14-May-2019 16:08:42 by Dennorak

Dennorak

Dennorak

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For those who have done the quest, there is dialogue missing from Roald/Amik due to a bug, I will post it here:

R: It's quite hard being the king you know.
R: When your literal god is nearby, no one really wants to listen the king.
A: I can imagine
R: No one really wants your advice as a king when your god is next door.
R: Oh they'll come round and say hi.
R :But its only ever for the paperwork.
R: No one really WANTS to know. You know?
A: Yes your majesty, terribly tragic.
A: My heart overflows with sympathy for you.
A: But I really must urge you back to the point at hand.
A: I need to know how many young men you can push to the white knights.
R: Conscription? Really? Is this what we have come to?
R: We're not at war, what could we possibly need to conscript for?
A: Begging your pardon your majesty, but I must correct you.
A: We are not at war, yet..
A: The black knights are up to something, we need to be prepared for them.
R: Fine fine fine. What Saradomin wants, Saradomin gets.
R: But I think it's all fuss over nothing.

Daquarius/Crane/Blacklock also have dialogue hinting at future Kinshra vs White Knight conflict. Something is being built up there for future story, and I am quite interested at where it's going.
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14-May-2019 17:11:57 - Last edited on 14-May-2019 17:13:05 by Dennorak

Dennorak

Dennorak

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I would be curious about Kerapac's original (fake?) plan of just keeping them in a state of perpetual sleep? Why wouldn't that work? I have a feeling it would, but with what the Elders did to the Dragonkin Kerapac probably wants a more satisfying form of revenge.
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15-May-2019 04:45:30

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Hazeel said:
Dennorak said:
I would be curious about Kerapac's original (fake?) plan of just keeping them in a state of perpetual sleep? Why wouldn't that work? I have a feeling it would, but with what the Elders did to the Dragonkin Kerapac probably wants a more satisfying form of revenge.


This was Xenia's plan. Then Ariane stopped it, resulting in the Elders waking up prematurely. Now that they're awake, that ship has sailed.

It wasnít her plan. Her plan involved draining Gielinor of anima to starve the elder gods. Kerapacís was to use the needle to keep them in an eternal state of sleep.
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15-May-2019 05:18:40

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Hazeel said:
Dennorak said:
Hazeel said:
Dennorak said:
I would be curious about Kerapac's original (fake?) plan of just keeping them in a state of perpetual sleep? Why wouldn't that work? I have a feeling it would, but with what the Elders did to the Dragonkin Kerapac probably wants a more satisfying form of revenge.


This was Xenia's plan. Then Ariane stopped it, resulting in the Elders waking up prematurely. Now that they're awake, that ship has sailed.

It wasnít her plan. Her plan involved draining Gielinor of anima to starve the elder gods. Kerapacís was to use the needle to keep them in an eternal state of sleep.


Her plan was to prevent them from waking. This would have never starved the Elder Gods. If you want to starve them, you need to remove all life (or change its nature). Much like plants create oxygen, life creates anima. Even removing it would only be temporary solution, unless you have a constant vacuum effect.

Original message details are unavailable.
The elder gods feed on the Anima Mundi, the natural flow of energy in the world. If we were to take that energy and siphon it away, then the elder gods would never wake up.

They key difference there is that Xenia's plan would involve Gielinor losing its magic, no? Without the anima we wouldn't have magic.
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15-May-2019 21:16:56

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Lego†Miester said:
Dennorak said:
For those who have done the quest, there is dialogue missing from Roald/Amik due to a bug, I will post it here:

R: It's quite hard being the king you know.
R: When your literal god is nearby, no one really wants to listen the king.
A: I can imagine
R: No one really wants your advice as a king when your god is next door.
R: Oh they'll come round and say hi.
R :But its only ever for the paperwork.
R: No one really WANTS to know. You know?
A: Yes your majesty, terribly tragic.
A: My heart overflows with sympathy for you.
A: But I really must urge you back to the point at hand.
A: I need to know how many young men you can push to the white knights.
R: Conscription? Really? Is this what we have come to?
R: We're not at war, what could we possibly need to conscript for?
A: Begging your pardon your majesty, but I must correct you.
A: We are not at war, yet..
A: The black knights are up to something, we need to be prepared for them.
R: Fine fine fine. What Saradomin wants, Saradomin gets.
R: But I think it's all fuss over nothing.

Daquarius/Crane/Blacklock also have dialogue hinting at future Kinshra vs White Knight conflict. Something is being built up there for future story, and I am quite interested at where it's going.


Do you have that backwards? Roald isn't the king. Then I'm still confused, because Amik isn't the king either. Leader of the white knights, yes, but not the king. We haven't seen him in ages and they just kind of took over.

I'm very confused. Who were the two characters talking?

I'm not understanding? Roald is the King of Misthalin. R = Roald, A = Amik.
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16-May-2019 01:28:57

Dennorak

Dennorak

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They canít make Sliskeís endgame a requirement for every 6th age quest now. Thatís a lengthy quest series with high requirements which would essentially mean every new 6th age quest is only doable by a small percentage of the community. Resetting requirements is the easiest solution to that issue.
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16-May-2019 21:13:00

Dennorak

Dennorak

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@Handkerchief

You're missing the point behind why SE and TWW are not requirements. At some point, every story quest Jagex releases can't be locked behind lengthy quest series with high requirements that only a small portion of the game can play. If they had to do that, the result would be even fewer quests than what we get because it's simply not a worthwhile investment in the game.

That's the point of "resetting" requirements, so to speak. It allows people to jump into a new quest series, and that's why the quest tried to refresh your memory of the events of The World Wakes to keep you caught on with what happened. They SUGGEST you do Sliske's Endgame for obvious reasons, but if the player wants to do Desperate Times before Sliske's Endgame, then that is their choice. Forcing players and as a result locking large portions of the player base out of content isn't a smart concept.
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17-May-2019 23:09:12

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Lord†Drakan said:
Dennorak said:
@Handkerchief

You're missing the point behind why SE and TWW are not requirements. At some point, every story quest Jagex releases can't be locked behind lengthy quest series with high requirements that only a small portion of the game can play. If they had to do that, the result would be even fewer quests than what we get because it's simply not a worthwhile investment in the game.

That's the point of "resetting" requirements, so to speak. It allows people to jump into a new quest series, and that's why the quest tried to refresh your memory of the events of The World Wakes to keep you caught on with what happened. They SUGGEST you do Sliske's Endgame for obvious reasons, but if the player wants to do Desperate Times before Sliske's Endgame, then that is their choice. Forcing players and as a result locking large portions of the player base out of content isn't a smart concept.

I keep hearing this, but I don't get it. As far as I know, quest requirements work encouragingly. Back in the day, when I saw a quest with many requirements (e.g. WGS), I didn't decide not to do it, I thought 'oh let's do all those quests then!' The more quest requirements there are, the more people quest. Of course it's a long-term thing. But for some reason only people doing the quest on release count?

I'm sure Jagex looks at how many people are doing the quest later on, but that doesn't mean the amount of people working their way up the requirements is satisfactory for the amount of effort that goes into questing. It's not like RuneScape has a ton of new players, most of its player base has been around a while. If they haven't gotten into questing now, releasing a new high tier quest likely isn't going to do much to motivate them.
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18-May-2019 17:05:15

Dennorak

Dennorak

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Solonduin said:
ok maby im being dumb but how can this quest not have mandatory requirments including endgame and the light within? how can seren exist before you restore her during the events of the ligh within. this whole quest just feels like a cheap way for jagex to introduce more mxt into the game and yet another bonus xp weekend I thoroughly enjoy questing for the lore and the dialoge and this whole quest just kinda pisses me off I feel like it devalues people who have worked hard to get the quest cape and followed the lore since it has literally zero requriments and yet seren is suddenly alive?? ok maby im beign stupid with my lore and ive missed somthing but im pretty sure seren only existed after the events of the light within at least in her coporal form? I mean come on jagex if your gonna release a quest based around somthing as massive as seren's retuern after she shattered herself into crystals to save her elves at least make it quests locked???

Same reason you can do 6th age quests without finishing every single 5th age quest in the game. It would lock out too many people, it's a brand new story line and they want to open it up to as many people as realistically possible.
Zamorakian Lorehound, Flame of Chaos member, Bilrach enthusiast

30-May-2019 06:53:20

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