Forums

Raffle being lazy

Quick find code: 74-75-350-65960156

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.
I wouldn't call it a troll update like the others his or her alt has listed because it's more of player intent to misuse the updates as opposed to Jagex encouraging trolling rather than making money.


Exactly.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

14-Sep-2017 11:25:20 - Last edited on 14-Sep-2017 11:26:46 by Draco Burnz

The contents of this message have been hidden

14-Sep-2017 12:51:21

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.
They didn't attempt to avoid people rigging the raffles, infact they done the opposite and sought to encourage it


Maybe its due to the fact that doing anything would do more harm than good:@

I mean if they started to ban 1 person for using alts, theyd have to for everyone....
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

04-Oct-2017 22:47:15

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
Disruptive behavior?
Using alts to exploit game mechanics? Both against the rules, both very subjective, but very possible for "raffle-rigging" to fall under.

I think the easier solution is just to not hold raffles in the first place. Especially ones where there are a limited number of prizes, encouraging alt abuse.


Why should they stop doing something just because of one rotten apple?

Plus if it was against the rules, dont you think they wouldve done something by now?...

Come on, at least use some logic.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 21:06:15

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
Why do you assume it's only one person doing it? By not taking action, it encourages more people to abuse it in future. And those people that abuse it prrrobably won't advertise it to the world like the specific instance you're referencing.

But maybe the reason they haven't done something is because they're done with raffles


Well unless others are not making a big deal over it how can i know if theres more than one?

Again, use some logic.

Thus for the time being i can only talk about that one person.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 21:43:51

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
It doesn't take someone admitting to botting in a video to make you understand that there's more than one botter. Plus if you've been paying attention on the forums, there's at least a few other people using alts in the raffle...

Regardless, the way raffles are set up, it only takes one person with enough time and alts to cause a massive amount of disruption. And since one such person has advertised his actions, it's not unlikely for others to mimic him when the next raffle comes around, amplifying the issue.


I can ask you the same thing, why are you assuming there is more than one person?
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 22:07:50

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
Not really. RSC was full of bots that were never banned. That doesn't mean botting was within the rules.

Regardless of the rules, it's an issue with the raffle and should be addressed.


It has been addressed before and im pretty sure theyve said they arent going to do anything about it.

Tenebri said:
IIRC. theres no mention of using alts to exploit game mechanics. what the rule is is exploiting game mechanics to enhance one account like stealing creations.

just to clarify im not 100%, but if the only effected accounts are individually the alts, then theres no rule break.

even though i dont condone doing this. i think that is the rule

ill also ask where would you draw the line? 1 account obviously fine, 1000 accounts is a no. is 1 main 1 alt okay? 500 not? which number is the limit? out of curiousity


Agreed.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 22:44:53

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
Easy. Instead of making it a limited number of items for everyone, make it a fixed chance. Then it's not really a raffle, but at least then people can't abuse it to make other people less likely to get something.


Yet some ppl like the rng aspect of the raffle.

So once again it seems like we're just going in one big circle:

Why ruin something just because of a few/one bad apple(s)?
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 23:02:54

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Tenebri said:
"Similarly, multi-logged accounts must not interact with each other to exploit gameplay mechanics, such as attempting to rig the result of a minigame.

The rule here would be multiple accounts interacting eachother to exploit gameplay mechanics. Technically they're not interacting with eachother, but they are interacting with the same piece of content, influencing its result. It's grey."

they arent interacting with each other though, they are interacting with the same npc. but thats how you enter the raffle.

i used stealing creations before as that would be rigging it. castle wars easier to use as an example, one on zammy one on sara, the alt on sara takes zammy flag and doesnt score with it. rigging the game against rules...

this isnt the case for this, they are all individually involved in the raffle. the only things thats effected with huge number of alts doing it. is obviously chance of getting the said winning prize. but then thats also said with 2 accounts, youve increased chance by double.


Exactly.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 23:15:04

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
A fixed 1/500 chance is still an RNG element so it wouldn't bother those people that "like the rng aspect" nor would that ruin anything for anyone.

The question you should be asking is, why should Jagex allow something to be ruined by a few bad apples, and do nothing about it?


Like how you say this w/o any proof.

How do you know it wouldnt bother anyone, have you asked said ppl?
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 23:34:00

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Miu said:
The winnings may only affect one account, but the chances impact everyone. Therein lies the issue with the raffle. You're focusing on whether it's "abuse" or not and not on potential solutions.

If the raffle was done with fixed chances, then you could do as many alts as you like, but none of those alts would negatively impact anyone else.


Yet why call it a "raffle" at this point?

You just have to deal that ppl will abuse anything they can and sometimes theres nothing that can/will be done.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 23:51:29

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Tenebri said:
just wanted to make sure i understood where you stand on the "issue" im still going to use my alt on raffle (just the one dont worry). as the chance of the raffle is for individual accounts not people behind them.


Dont see why it matter how many you use as nothing will ever happen.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

25-May-2018 23:56:36

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
Did you want it to return with a fixed number of rewards that can be rigged? Thats specifically what i was referring to in the above post


Uhh, tbh theres no way to change that it'll always have a limited amount of rewards as i dont think its possible to make something have "unlimited" number of rewards so...
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

30-Jun-2018 03:20:33

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
I would find it disappointing if you cant use your 1 alt account and 1 main account. I was thinking having a minimin skill total would be a better option, but oh well


Yet again lvl req do no good as ppl can easily reach them no matter the number of acc.

Yes it might take a while but if a person has enough time on their hands...
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

31-Aug-2018 17:00:02

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Tenebri said:
you can say meth sales are a hit yes. cause well it is in high demand with a high price, and has a huge income.


yes 9/11 did happen because of religion. i dont see what that has to do here? its not about beliefs....


fine ill try once more for your brain to try understand.

you go to a pool party
you dislike that people can pee in a pool
the owner of said house of pool party. says he doesnt care.
does you complaining about it do anything?
the pool party is now over.
you still constantly talk about 1 person peeing in the pool.
is the owner now going to do something about it even though its now finished?


i lolled at "unthinkable" acts.... you honestly think what he did was unthinkably immoral?

rofl thats actually hilarious


Have to agree here.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

06-Nov-2018 01:08:53

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
You have always just came here to disagree lol but w/e. I have explained why I think that argument doesn't hold up.


Just like you have to keep accusing ppl of wrong-doing when they didnt do anything.

Plus ive also explained why you "ideas" shouldnt happen.

So i guess we're at an impasse.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

15-Nov-2018 21:05:42

The contents of this message have been hidden

21-Nov-2018 01:47:31

The contents of this message have been hidden

21-Nov-2018 02:38:53

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
You would report a person for rigging castle wars by putting his alts and main as the teams. When all he can get is nonprofit items like capes and halos.

But you won't report any events being rigged that profit billions because it doesn't specifically say events in the rules?


Yep as jagex have said themselves this isnt against the rules.

Misuse of the report system is though ;)
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

05-Dec-2018 23:26:44

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
The raffle is not intended to be rigged. At all. Hence the reason they limit the number of tickets available per account, and why they don't sell the tickets outright allowing everybody to have access to higher odds.


Yet its not being rigged and jagex have confirmed this person isnt.

So whos the ignorant one again?
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

06-Dec-2018 22:08:59

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Tenebri said:
hes just ignoring everything he doesnt agree with....

especially as he purposely ignored the questions to keep this conversation on track. yet just doesnt help the conversation at all. and seems to be talking about anything he feels fit and doesnt care if its on topic or not.... so meh not feeding troll


Yea this is getting boring.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

06-Dec-2018 23:04:06

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
I think the problem here is you guys are saying raffle rigging isn't against the rules, so we should allow it while I'm saying that due to the harm it does to the game it should be changed to being against the rules.

I still believe the rules need to be checked again.


The rules have been checked.

Its just you that wants this person banned for no good reason.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

10-Dec-2018 20:34:19

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
This is Immoral, and the unfairly won limited time prizes, wasted. People wanted those. Do you just not care? Or is it wrong for them to feel cheated?


How did this person unfairly win any items?

Did he not enter a ticket on each acc?

Did he not earn each ticket like everyone else?

So from those points it just seems like a personal issue against this person.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

12-Dec-2018 00:33:59

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
Read Iron's signature. Stand up for what's Right, not what's allowed. Just because something is allowed currently doesn't make it right. Hence our argument for Morality, which for some reason, you care nothing about.


Yet you're the only ppl who think it isnt right.

Jagex and most others dont seem to care.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

12-Dec-2018 02:58:23

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
We are talking about the unfair alt use, be it in the raffle or not. And I am expanding it to all limited events because the raffle is only one of many that get rigged. Stop minimizing everything.


Yet once again, it only "unfair" in yours and OP's minds. No one elses.

Thus theres nothing wrong going on here.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

13-Dec-2018 04:20:06

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
Whatusaytome said:
why not simply allow tickets to be bought? For gp, loyalty points, rc, dollars, whatever.
Already been said I'm fine with another method as long as it's openly available to people.


LOL

Like how ppl dislike th for being p2w yet this would make the raffles pretty much the same thing ;)
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

21-Dec-2018 00:04:16

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
The raffle is not p2w. Paying to have better odds at a raffle is not p2w. Only the xp here can boost people, and there's not that much of it, even if you win it that day.

If p2w was their goal for xp, they'd invest in th, not the raffle. So I don't see the problem here.


How is paying to get better odds thus pretty much as close to near guarantee you can get not p2w?

I mean you'll be getting armors and weapons that have stats and can help out ingame?

Thus the very definition of p2w.

Plus why would you see anything wrong here, you're wanting it thus it wouldnt make sense for you to see any downsides...
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

21-Dec-2018 00:42:37 - Last edited on 21-Dec-2018 00:43:28 by Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
No, paying for odds is not a guaranteed win. TH is always guaranteed prizes. The raffle may clean you and give you nothing. So it's not p2w.


I never said it was 100% guaranteed now did I?

Plz reread what i did say:

Draco Burnz said:
How is paying to get better odds thus pretty much as close to near guarantee you can get not p2w?


Whatusaytome said:
People don't use golden's for combat. They use the repairable versions. They use goldens for cosmetic interest, mostly by keepsake or equipping without using. If you actually use them for combat, you still aren't even close to being tiered enough for most bosses. So it's not p2w.


How do you know this for sure?

I mean if they cant afford the normal armor but can wear it, id see why theyd use it.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

21-Dec-2018 01:45:45 - Last edited on 21-Dec-2018 01:48:11 by Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
what boost are those golden armors and weapons for level 3 throwaway accounts?


None but im not talking about those, im talking about ppl who can wear/weild them but cant afford the normal versions.

This is insane to get free lvl 75 armors/weapons with almost no risk involved.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

21-Dec-2018 11:19:32

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Tenebri said:
and im discussing them... jesus you are difficult


so you arent going to give me more information on your idea. cause i have the "general idea" of it.

nice help you are.. have good time this is why things havent changed since the start of thread.... congrats
best to give more information on your idea. then we can go into a compromise.... its how things work, there actually needs to be a discussion. if you arent willing to discuss your own idea. why even post off topic stuff?



good luck to anyone else wanting a "discussion" youll just get pushed to off topic, then get told you are troll. even though your questions never get answered and are the one keeping it being on topic by only responding to the topic itself

dont accuse me of what you are doing yourself it just shows lack of respect for yourself and the person you are speaking to


Have to agree here.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

22-Dec-2018 21:44:37

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
All we want is to make it so people cant rig the raffle with the intention of diluting the reward pool for others. You can make a hard cap of how many alt accounts you can use before it is most likely going into that (i.e. 10 accounts). That doesnt impair players rights except those rigging the raffle. Period.


Yet its pretty much near impossible to do this w/o hurting legit players.

I mean it makes no sense for there to be any caps, nothing is tradeable thus it doesnt hurt the economy in the slightest.

I get it you want better chances at rewards, but sometimes you cant always have everything you want.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

27-Dec-2018 00:52:56 - Last edited on 27-Dec-2018 00:53:33 by Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
I think it is more important to do something that will negatively affect very few accounts then to leave a problem that hurts everyone. If you limit the amount of accounts you can enter the raffle in to 10, then almost all players will have no loss (maybe a few) but the players benefit with more rewards that were intended to be given to them.


Thats the thing though, the rewards arent meant to be easy to get so by limiting the amount that can enter, you are doing just that.

Hence why it doesnt make sense to put a cap on this.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

29-Dec-2018 11:40:49

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whatusaytome said:
He says it isn't meant to be easy, but one player multiplying his own odds and lowering everybody else's odds for his own gain is fine. It's allowed and meant to be easy for him, but not us. That's why he's against the limit.


Plz dont mis-quote what i said.

Jagex is as much for this as i am as they have said multiple times this person isnt doing anything wrong.

So far you 2 are the only ones saying he is.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

29-Dec-2018 15:14:20

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
Also we are saying the rules should be changed to reflect the immorality of raffle riggers actions. It is why people are no longer allowed to shoot scotish people sailig into the UK despite it being allowed in the past.


Yet jagex have said there isnt anything wrong, thus no need for any rule changes.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

30-Dec-2018 01:52:46

The contents of this message have been hidden

01-Jan-2019 02:36:05

The contents of this message have been hidden

01-Jan-2019 20:24:59

The contents of this message have been hidden

02-Jan-2019 23:15:03

The contents of this message have been hidden

02-Jan-2019 23:16:49

The contents of this message have been hidden

02-Jan-2019 23:23:50

The contents of this message have been hidden

02-Jan-2019 23:30:48

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
Why not ask Jagex to do a poll it to see if the majority of the community would prefer another method, such as an alt cap?

You can disagree with every opinion stated, but I think the only way to determine if its best is to poll it and see what the whole community thinks.


Considering this whole thing is your idea, why not you ask them?
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

06-Jan-2019 01:54:40

Draco Burnz

Draco Burnz

Posts: 60,406Emerald Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironman Gup said:
Most of the community is unhappy with raffle rigging. If you truly believe there is no option to make raffle rigging better, why not poll it with the community?


Un not really.

Where do you get this info that most are upset about this?

From what ive seen on reddit and what not, most have seem to come to an acceptance of it as theres nothing that can be done w/o hurting legit players.

You still seem to be the lonely person that wants this in place.

Plus once again, your idea so you ask them.
Draco Burnz
True Collector of cosmetics
7th year VIP 2013-2019

06-Jan-2019 02:38:32 - Last edited on 06-Jan-2019 02:45:37 by Draco Burnz

Quick find code: 74-75-350-65960156Back to Top