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Cultural Elements & Saradomin?

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Giras
Sep Gold Premier Club Member 2012

Giras

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I was going to say that Kronos' age was one that the earth provided everything mortals needed without work but Hguoh beat me to it.

Also, according to Interpretations of Greek Mythology (Routledge Revivals) written by By Jan N. Bremmer, Euhemerus' view (Ennius Euhemerus 9.5) states that Kronos and Rhea and other people living at the time ate the flesh of humans.

As for people who don't try to live not surviving? Yeah no shit. Mods have confirmed that Zamorak believes everyone has the inner strength to draw on in order to surpass themselves. The people who themselves have already given up are beyond help. As for slavery... many slaves throughout the ages have decided that they'd rather die fighting than suffer the indignity of being a slave. Saradomin is another slavemaster that will eventually be overthrown like the rest.
I'm no one's servant!

Good. Never let anyone think differently
.

30-Sep-2017 02:42:55

Padomenes
Apr Member 2015

Padomenes

Posts: 3,641Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Giras said:
I was going to say that Kronos' age was one that the earth provided everything mortals needed without work but Hguoh beat me to it.

Also, according to Interpretations of Greek Mythology (Routledge Revivals) written by By Jan N. Bremmer, Euhemerus' view (Ennius Euhemerus 9.5) states that Kronos and Rhea and other people living at the time ate the flesh of humans.

As for people who don't try to live not surviving? Yeah no shit. Mods have confirmed that Zamorak believes everyone has the inner strength to draw on in order to surpass themselves. The people who themselves have already given up are beyond help. As for slavery... many slaves throughout the ages have decided that they'd rather die fighting than suffer the indignity of being a slave. Saradomin is another slavemaster that will eventually be overthrown like the rest.
There's many sources/interpretation on that, and also you are assuming a just world fallacy here. That somebody who rises to the top won't want to eventually stop putting effort into it like everybody else.

I was making no hint of that but suggesting that slavery where you have basic needs provided despite anything is much better than death/homelessness which there is nothing worse than.

The people who have supposedly 'given up' were often put into circumstances where they started out trapped in a viscious cycle. Saradomin wants to provide all with basic needs they need to survive. Even everything in Falador appears to be run and managed by Saradomin and his followers, with nobody else owning them?

Saradomin wants to deter aggressors whom threaten his protected.
Saradominist
,
INFP(Possibly also ENFP)
, Democratic Socialist irl

30-Sep-2017 03:23:42 - Last edited on 30-Sep-2017 03:25:15 by Padomenes

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

Posts: 7,428Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said:
Saradomin wants to deter aggressors whom threaten his protected.


Even when said aggressors happen to be his protected, of course.

*cough* Naragun *cough* Garlandia *cough*

Sorry, frog in my throat.

30-Sep-2017 03:36:37

Padomenes
Apr Member 2015

Padomenes

Posts: 3,641Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Hguoh said:
Padomenes said:
Saradomin wants to deter aggressors whom threaten his protected.


Even when said aggressors happen to be his protected, of course.

*cough* Naragun *cough* Garlandia *cough*

Sorry, frog in my throat.
Naragun was thousands of years ago and his changed since then, plus tried to make up for it despite failing to do so in efforts.

The punishment used to Garlandia had to be strictly used because it was a form of Icyenic tradition deemed appropriate for certain people inside their own culture. So that lack of appreciation for a different culture again.
Saradominist
,
INFP(Possibly also ENFP)
, Democratic Socialist irl

30-Sep-2017 04:33:04 - Last edited on 30-Sep-2017 04:33:44 by Padomenes

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

Posts: 7,428Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said:
Naragun was thousands of years ago and his changed since then, plus tried to make up for it despite failing to do so in efforts.

The punishment used to Garlandia had to be strictly used because it was a form of Icyenic tradition deemed appropriate for certain people inside their own culture.


Yes, Pads, I was deliberately trying to get your goat.

That being said, I find myself wary about trusting Saradomin given the ways he behaved in those situations. There is no justification for his actions on Naragun, so I will always hold him to his actions there. Similarly whilst the Icyene tradition might be to cripple their criminals and leave them to die of exposure, I will judge him for his willingness to not only condone the practice but also to personally participate in such barbarity.

Padomenes said:
So that lack of appreciation for a different culture again.


Let's stop with the cultural relativism please. There are some practices of cultures throughout history that are verifiably worse than those of others. Slavery is one (think about it, without knowing to whom you'd be born, would you rather be born into a society without slaves or one where half the population is enslaved?). Dismembering is another (permanent damage to a person physically and mentally that is unnecessarily painful for a limited crime).

30-Sep-2017 22:07:29 - Last edited on 30-Sep-2017 22:44:58 by Hguoh

Hazeel

Hazeel

Posts: 6,718Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said:
The punishment used to Garlandia had to be strictly used because it was a form of Icyenic tradition deemed appropriate for certain people inside their own culture. So that lack of appreciation for a different culture again.


In my culture we burn each other's houses down. So can Saradomin stop disrespecting Zamorakian culture and kindly screw off?
Runescape doesn't need a hero...it needs a villain. An all encompassing force of evil that will remain ever-threatening and use chaos to make the peoples of Gielinor tolerate each other, grow strong together, and fight side by side against this evil. I am that villain.

30-Sep-2017 22:18:13

Giras
Sep Gold Premier Club Member 2012

Giras

Posts: 2,383Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said:
There's many sources/interpretation on that, and also you are assuming a just world fallacy here. That somebody who rises to the top won't want to eventually stop putting effort into it like everybody else.

I was making no hint of that but suggesting that slavery where you have basic needs provided despite anything is much better than death/homelessness which there is nothing worse than.

The people who have supposedly 'given up' were often put into circumstances where they started out trapped in a viscious cycle. Saradomin wants to provide all with basic needs they need to survive. Even everything in Falador appears to be run and managed by Saradomin and his followers, with nobody else owning them?

Saradomin wants to deter aggressors whom threaten his protected.

HAHAHAHAHA! Good one! Oh Zamorak... you're actually serious?!?!?

Saradominism is the posterboy for just world fallacy as you have a clear history in exploiting the lower classes. Need I remind you that Icyene comforts are prioritized over human lives and wellbeing anyday? Or how Icyene commanders routinely stripped entire human villages of all working age people during the godwars to send as cannon fodder on a front line that's moved like two inches in the last 500 years?

Vicious cycle? So a culture in which it is legal and encouraged to rise from your limitations is now somehow worse than one with
distinct social classes
,
established social immobility
, and a government that
actively enforces the systemic exploitation of the lower classes
now?

Lastly we come to slavery... you do understand that serfdom is a thing in runescape right? Since Zamorakians don't live within the system, they're not the main owners and operators of serfdoms. Systemic ownership of people is legal and practiced in saradominist society. Example: Assistant Serf
I'm no one's servant!

Good. Never let anyone think differently
.

30-Sep-2017 22:50:39 - Last edited on 30-Sep-2017 22:51:23 by Giras

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

Posts: 7,428Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Heck, even execution has been or is being recognized as a poor practice as well (given the occasional execution of wrongfully prosecuted innocents and its failure in actually deterring criminals) in most of the modern world. This is particularly evident in cases where people are executed or prosecuted for non-violent dissent against the ruling power as this inevitably comes back around to bite the ones in power when another ideology ends up in leadership (see the back and forth in England's Kings/Queens from Protestant to Catholic and their back and forth persecution of each other).

30-Sep-2017 22:51:59

Giras
Sep Gold Premier Club Member 2012

Giras

Posts: 2,383Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Hazeel said:
Padomenes said:
The punishment used to Garlandia had to be strictly used because it was a form of Icyenic tradition deemed appropriate for certain people inside their own culture. So that lack of appreciation for a different culture again.


In my culture we burn each other's houses down. So can Saradomin stop disrespecting Zamorakian culture and kindly screw off?

LOL! Hey Pado... you're going to need Jaina to fix that burn!
I'm no one's servant!

Good. Never let anyone think differently
.

01-Oct-2017 04:36:01

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