Forums

Lore Corner - Answers!Thread is locked

Quick find code: 341-342-691-65870907

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Bowi said:
Now Mah is gone the last small 'hope' for a Ritual of Enervation is gone, does this mean the Mahjarrat will slowly become extinct despite a female Mahjarrat being alive and the removal of the other ritual?


The power that the Mahjarrat received during that event will no doubt be able to sustain them indefinitely, or at least to the point where it’s no longer an issue for the decline of their species (at least not in any amount of time the player will be around for). I’d say the opposite is now true; they have now an abundance of power from which they could create new Mahjarrat, should they so choose (though many of the remaining Mahjarrat are quite selfish

17-Jan-2017 19:06:14

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Helring said:
What races were Rief, Thera, Ria, Atrew, and Aeternam and what planes were they from? I just want to know which planes we'd need to visit to meet them now,

Rief sounded like he could have been a Demon/Auspah, Thera a Spirit Tree, Ria an Icyene, and not sure what Atrew or Aeternam was.


In the "Time" memory. Is Guthix discussing a conversation we will have with him in the future, or is he talking about our brief meeting during The Light Within?


To add to Stu's post...

In Time, yes, that’s the point in The Light Within where the player uses the key to meet with Guthix in your past.

17-Jan-2017 19:07:30

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Chaos Lupus said:
9.) Once and for all, can you explicitly outright confirm that Vanstrom Klause was Ascertes?


I think I already did, somewhere, post-River of Blood. I don’t recall. But, yes, he was.

17-Jan-2017 19:08:33

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Rondstat said:
Ooh, fun!

1. The first act of River of Blood made great pains to establish the Splinter Group as a major antagonist - revealing their long-standing manipulation of the Myreque, giving their (presumptive) leader unrestricted access to Paterdomus, Blisterwood, and a vampyrized Seergaze, and putting us on the cusp of the war they had been working towards. And then they disappear from the quest. Was there originally a third act planned that would have seen us face off against the conspirators, but that was cut for time/budget?

2. I maintain a list of written languages that appear in Runescape. While a lot of work went into mapping out Vampyric, is this the exception or the rule? Do most scripts have a meaning known to the developers? Are they design motifs meant to maintain consistency between similarly themed environments? Or are they usually the sole purview of an environmental artist, adding flair to a new location at their own discretion?

3. Falador standing stones. Do you guys know what they're for? You don't have to tell us, just - is there a specific significance in the lore bible?


1) Truth be told, no, that was never in any planned form of the finale. Our focus was always on finishing the journey for the (remaining) Myreque – Ivan had his heroic moment and became caretaker of Paterdomus, Safalaan finally got some much needed support to stop him making stupid decisions all the time, and Veliaf came to terms with his grief and (begrudgingly) accepted the new normal. And you put an end to the vampyre threat (mostly, for now).

2) I think they have a tendency to occur when certain mods are involved in a project. Concept artists like to add little details, and I’m the sort of person to build on that. We encourage each other. For instance, there is a Kharidian alphabet in-game too, which I don’t think anyone has worked out (at least not in full), as you don’t have a Rosetta Stone-like artefact to make sense of it. That was added with Stolen Hearts/Diamond in the Rough, and we’re considering what more we can do with it along with Menaphos…

3) They received some context with the Balance Elemental memory in Memorial to Guthix…

17-Jan-2017 19:09:47

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Lethalintent said:
1. Is it planned for Xau-Tak and the Queen of Ashes to be long term characters if and when they are finally introduced? Not just Guthix'd or worse V'd off. I appreciate death being necessary for the plot to sometimes advance, but not having it be at the start of every meeting would be great,

2. Are Zaros and or Seren aware of Xau-Tak? Should the latter decide to stir and do any kind of harm, what's to stop the siblings from wiping him out?

3. Can the situation with Zaros locating Saradomins daughter be elaborated on? Was it a rescue mission? Why doesn't Saradomin now that she's safe just destroy this Obsidian Tribunal?

4. On the subject, is the Obsidian Tribunal just Zaros's name for what we know as the Teragard Magisters or are they separate groups?

5. Azzanadra sounds close to Godhood, should this hypothetically happen, would he be accepting of his new state of being?

6. How is it possible for Saradomin to have a daughter? Is she his Great great great.. Etc Granddaughter but just shortens it to save everyone 5 minutes?

7. Is it possible for Char to be involved more in storylines? Are there any plans for this? I feel she hasn't had any spotlight since her initial quest and the poor girl needs a graphical polish as it is.

8. Where do you see the story going after the Elder Gods? Have you thought that far ahead? How can anything ever match up to meeting and humbling them to let life they created continue on its natural course? I never want quests to end, but I'm not sure anything could top that eventual Finale.

9. During Endgame we had the chance to let most of the gods know where we stand with them, if you told them outright you stood against them has this permanently burned all bridges between your player and said god?


1. I think it’s nice to have some less fleshed out/background characters. I’m not saying that’s the case with these two, just not that every god ever name-checked needs to make an appearance/have their own quest series, etc.

2. I’d be surprised if they weren’t aware of these gods’ existence. That they’re not much mentioned probably suggests how unconcerned by them they are.

3. I’m sure it will be at some point.

5. It becomes an interesting point specifically with Azzy. Would he see that as heresy? Blasphemy? I imagine the thought makes him very uncomfortable, but also gives him mixed feelings.

7. She does, doesn’t she. I felt the same including her in Fate of the Gods, compared with everyone else.

8. Yes, we’ve thought very far ahead…at least in terms of possibilities. The Lore Council are mostly on the same page for ‘what happens next’ in the wake of Endgame. We’re still discussing in more detail how the dragonkin and elder god narratives will shape up. Beyond that we have a number of options.

They’re good to have, as they then tend to seep into content we’re creating, like the [redacted] character that will be in [redacted], and the story of the [redacted] that you might hear about at some point this year, plus the lore surrounding the Needle that’s the focus of Idle Adventures.

Collectively, we’re thinking that we need to make things more personal and character-led again for a while. The great thing with the elder gods is that things come full circle back to mortals, so we don’t need something “bigger” than them.

17-Jan-2017 19:11:15

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
ChernoAlpha said:
2. During the flashback in Children of Mah, Zaros seems very uncaring toward the Mahjarrat, and even slightly disgusted by them, dismissing them as glorified mercenaries who fight for whoever is at the top of the food chain. However, in his memories in Fate of the Gods, he seems to care about them, even thinking fondly of them as his younger siblings, intending to take them under his wing and for them to inherit his empire. Which is Zaros's actual view? Was his dialogue in Children of Mah just an outburst in anger at Zamorak's betrayal, an inconsistency between writers, or an attempt to make him more morally grey after how benevolent he seemed in FotG?

3. It's been stated several times in the past that you cannot kill an Elder God. If this is the case, how did Seren manage it? Was Mah a special case due to her corruption and deformity, and having been drained of most of her divine energy by Zaros and the Mahjarrat?


2. I think it’s more than reasonable for Zaros to be flippant and cajoling of Zamorak during that CoM flashback, considering what Zammy is doing. One can care while also having the capability of saying mean things, especially if they feel they’re (currently) being betrayed. ESPECIALLY where it comes to siblings! I’d see it as an inconsistency if he weren’t shocked and angry (in as much as he can be emotive).

3. Regardless of the answer to the first sentence, Mah would be an exception to it – she’s a special case, as were the circumstances surrounding that event.

17-Jan-2017 19:13:25

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Zaro Asriel said:
Can you tell us anything about why Seren didn't just strike Sliske down when she was face to face with him at The Heart during Sliske's Endgame? was it that she didn't have the power to do so? or was she restraining herself? She seemed to feel some sort of sorrow for him when he mentioned her killing Mah hurting him, yet prior to this she stated if she ever saw him she would incinerate him with light. Contradictions left right and centre, any elaborations on this?


There’s a difference between what we say, and feel, and then do. Seren is an emotive and empathetic being. She might say much in the heat of the moment, but reason can still win out. I’d imagine she felt the situation (upon finding herself face-to-face with Sliske) tempered her. In the opposite way of how a seemingly emotionless, analytical being such as Zaros clearly seems to have a desire to be liked and does show feeling/caring at certain times. I would see these things simply as character, not contradiction.

17-Jan-2017 19:15:40

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Enquidou said:
Mod Osborne used the metaphor of a cheese with holes for RuneScape's multiverse. The holes are places where the worlds are found (e.g. Gielinor or the Naragi homeworld, whole star/solar systems, or even star systems), and the cheese itself represents is The Void, and the crust the Abyss. We were told this was sort of outdated and that it has been internally worked. Could you share this info with us pleeaasee??


Almost. The cheese would be the Abyss, and the rest of existence (anything not either cheese or a hole in the cheese) would be the Void. It’s still valid, if only a simple model. More accuracte would be a piece of cheese in the shape of a tube or torus, completed surrounded (within and without) by Void. That’s still a simple model.

17-Jan-2017 19:17:39

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Garlandiel said:
6) Can you explain us what the animal aspect of Menaphite Gods means? Tumeken and Elidinis have animal aspects respectively of a falcon and a hippo. So, can they transform themselves into these animals or it’s just a representation/symbol?

7) Who laid the five elder gods eggs on Freneskae? Who originated them? Did they have parents? If there was a male elder god, could they procreate?


6) Any god could change their form, should they wish. The reason they have animal aspects is solely because they were styled after Egyptian gods initially. What that actually means in Runescape terms is ill-defined at best. Perhaps it is something we can elaborate upon with the Menaphos update.

7) The previous cycle’s elder gods.

17-Jan-2017 19:18:56

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
The Aviansie said:
4. What would you say to a player that expresses anxiety that seemingly being so hasty to bring out the Elder Gods makes the young/faction Gods (let alone what has yet to be resolved in the Fifth Age!) "not matter?"

5. Following up from Question Four, why was the Elder God quest not mentioned in the Year Ahead video?

8. How canonically accurate are the ages stated for the GWD1 generals on Top Trumps?

9. How did Vindicta get all those troops, who use Nex armors, Nex weapons, and in the case of the meleers, chaotic mauls?

17. Are there even more Gods out there interested in Gielinor we've not heard about? Hero's Welcome seems to imply that the Universe is even more vast than what we can visit through the World Gate, and that on some of those worlds, there are more Gods.



4. I’d first say try not to be anxious.

5. A lot of things weren’t mentioned. It doesn’t have to mean anything.

8. I would not treat them as canon. They were our best estimation at the time of that project, but our collectively understanding has grown since then. That being said, many of them aren’t far off. The Gods Wars generals’ age would include their time in the ice. Kree’arra is a unique and special snowflake (well, maybe not unique, but he’s atypical of aviansie).

9. There are already more…a lot more. This topic was the basis of the Guardians of the World story sequence in Ports.

17. There are probably some we’ll never even hear about.

17-Jan-2017 19:21:13

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Enquidou said:
The Aviansie said:
6. Will we be seeing more Lores and Histories?

Yes!!!
And also just more other lore things, like journals, NPC dialogues, more MahMem or Memoriam to Guthix lore stuff. Maybe linked to skills perhaps? Like finding random lore bits while skilling, a box while mining, an interesting coin while farming (giving some dialogue with the people at the Varrock Museum), something in the pelt of an animal when we've successfully hunted it, a strange object in the ashes after/during the burning of logs, a peculiar note while thieving. A bit like bird's nest in woodcutting, but with lore stuff instead of jewelry and seeds.


A bit like to Memorial to Guthix, you mean? ;) That won’t be the last of these sorts of updates.

17-Jan-2017 19:22:02

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Big Storms said:
Something I have been pondering for a while: the Ilujanka, who have severe issues reproduction wise, live on a planet described as with a night sky devoid of stars. Does this mean their planet could be a remnant of the previous cycle, not being destroyed in the last Great Revision?

I especially wonder this because of the apparent connection Dragonkin share with the Ilujanka according to Kerapac. This would make sense if they share a similar origin. With the Dragonkin having their origin in the previous cycle, it makes sense if the Ilujanka do as well.

Continuing my pondering, is the issue the Illujanka are facing actually due to their world losing anima, a fate befallen on those areas which lack the elder gods their presence?


That theory on Iaia is very much akin to one I’ve been peddling since just after OOAK/FotG. Don’t treat it as canon until it’s in-game, however. The loss of anima is…actually, I’ll stop myself there.

17-Jan-2017 19:22:37

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Adventurerrr said:
Adventurers asked a bunch of questions...


Re: wisps as Ports crew:
They’re a natural source of light (ideal for lifting spirits on dark, stormy seas). I’d like to think they exude the sense of warmth that a positive memory can have. They’re also strangely good at tying knots.

Re: anima/divine energy/divinity:
In simple terms, you could see it as anima being akin to natural resources (e.g. crude oil), divine energy being a refined version of them (e.g. petrol), and magic being the result of burning those fuels (e.g. combustion).

Re: World Gate/fairy rings:
Nothing on fairy magic here, but… You can teleport from plane to plane without these things, given enough power – the power requirement depends on the distance you are travelling (and I’d imagine the distance between planes increases the further you are from Gielinor. As (finally) put in-game canon with Memorial to Guthix, the fairy ring network was created from the physical part of the World Gate that used to be on Zanaris. The World Gate (the network is ‘the Gate’) provides the necessary power, which is why they are so notable. It’s also why fairy rings are only found on planes that are relatively close to Gielinor (or require increase power from external sources to go further, e.g. the one to Yubiusk).


Re: how we canonically handle unique objects:
Quite simply, we don’t. Including an in-universe explanation for ludo-narrative dissonance (a disconnect between gameplay and story) is not always desirable or favourable, often is a ‘fudge’, and it’s rarely necessary. You are the sole adventurer (of note); all other adventurers that you see are not special. There are only a handful canonically unique items (e.g. Godsword, Sunspear).

Re: Godless and Invention:
In the earliest concepts of the Godless, they were intrinsically connected with Invention. How else would mortals hope to match gods without some sort of artificial/scientific implementation of magical power? Whether or not that will still be the case whenever we get to making Godless content remains to be seen.

Re: the fallen nihil:
That growth would have occurred after, possibly only with assistance/intervention from the Queen of Ashes.

Re: nihil in general:
This is not canonical, I wonder if the nihil are, and have always been, finite in number, unable to reproduce.

Re: where the Church of Brassica Prime is located:
“Eat your greens; I am there. Turn the soil, and you will find me.”

Re: the planned (?) 7th Age???
Is it planned? (I don’t think so.) The 6th Age will suffice for a good while yet.

Re: if Zaros would have helped the Mahjarrat:
I’d like to think he would have helped them, yes. It makes the deal even worse for Zamorak that way – forcing Zaros to do something he would have done anyway.

Re: the universe, multiverse, planes and other jargon:
All of creation that we know of is the universe – it may have initially been referred to as a multiverse, but that was incorrect. We only truly revealed a multiverse with the release of Dimension of Disaster, with that alternate timeline based on the player not existing there. The terms ‘planes’ and ‘realms’ are mostly interchangeable, and are pockets of creation that may contain multiple planets, moons and other celestial bodies, plus what we might call ‘space’, and entirely encompassed by the Abyss. There are other, small planes (often referred to as pocket universes) that contain other matter than celestial bodies (and typically no ‘space’), e.g. the Enchanted Valley, the rune altars, the Starflower Plane.

Re: light creatures:
The light creatures are their own race. The corruption caused by the Dark Lord turned turned many of them into Shadows. It is unknown how much of a consciousness they have.

17-Jan-2017 19:30:20

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Jexel L said:
4. Do the wizards of the Wizards' Tower have any knowledge of lunar spells? Are they able to cast them?

8. Did the Temple Knights in the Fourth and Fifth Ages really communicate directly with Saradomin?

10. Are there any gods other than the ones we know about who fought in the God Wars? If so, how many?

12. How old is the current cycle of the universe?

13. If an age ended (for instance, the transition from the Fifth Age to the Sixth Age) in the middle of the year, would year 1 of the new age be only half a year long?

14. Is the rune essence infinite? If not, will magic eventually die out without the Stone to make more essence?

15. Is divination energy infinite?


4. I’d like to think there’s at least one fringe professor studying lunar magic, stuck in the basement with little funding. There’s a lodestone on Lunar Isle; I’d imagine that suggests a magical community of sorts.

8. Someone instructed the Temple Knights how to construct the Salve barrier (during the Fourth Age), though that could have been instructions left for them (by Saradomin) and need not suggest direct communication with him.

10. No doubt.

12. We had a bit of a discussion about this a few weeks ago… Needless to say it’s not something we’ll reveal here, though.

13. I imagine that might depend on what caused the old age to end and/or the new one to begin.

14. I would strongly doubt that it is infinite; however, it’s not going to run out in our lifetime. Much like fossil fuels.

15. No. But again, it’s not running out anytime soon.

17-Jan-2017 19:32:11

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Czar said:
1. The Shadow Sword, is it a sword made in the Shadow realm and brought over?

2. This is a stretch, but is there a Smoke and Blood realm?

3. Are there other types of magic that have yet to be discovered? (Just a yes/no is fine)

4. Some items from Dungeoneering have strange effects, such as Shadow Silk. Would they retain any special abilities if brought outside Daemonheim?

5. Get ready for Ctho questions from me. How much can a Ctho do with the ability to shape shift? Does it go beyond "become this, become that"? Could a Ctho, hypothetically, become half man, half bear, and half pig?

6. Were all surviving Cthos sent to the Abyss? Could any have escaped being sent beforehand?


1. Knowing Khazard, it’s just a black-coloured steel sword and he thought “Shadow sword” just sounded cool. (Not canon.)

2. I posited the idea a few years back, but I think collectively we’re not keen on that idea.

3. Probably. (So, not fine? :P)

4. In technical terms, not they wouldn’t, as they have Dungeoneering area checks (in case someone manages to smuggle them out past our safety checks). In narrative terms, I imagine they would.

5. Well, no, because that would be three halves. Although…they are chthonians, so that might make sense for them.

6. Was it a banishment or an exodus? I’m sure there are a handful dotted around elsewhere (e.g. Penance).

17-Jan-2017 19:33:00

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Sodden Hound said:
2. Can a human (or other race requiring runes for magic) train themselves beyond the need for runes?

5. What's the difference between anima and divine energy? Is divine energy just a form of concentrated anima?

6. Is the act of souls going to the Underworld and Afterlife just a way of returning their anima to the planet? And-- Souls ARE a form of anima, right?

7. There ARE schools of magic beyond what the spellbooks show us and what appears in-game, right? Such as mind magic, nature magic, light magic, and so on?

9. Are onyxes from the TzHaar the same as onyxes in real life? Because onyxes in real life are just a form of common quartz, so TzHaar onyxes are likely something different - just with the same name, right?

10. Can we get more info/lore on the undead? There are wights, skeletons, ankous, and so on. Does the necromancer decide the degree of sentience/sapience they get, and what skills they get to keep (such as magic in the case of Ahrim or skeleton mages)? How does necromancy WORK? Does it screw with Death's "dead person" radar, making him think they're still alive unless he sees them in person?


1. I consider aquamancer and hydromancer as being mostly interchangeable. I would explain it away with language differentiation. Even in the same country, we don’t all refer to the same things with the same words. It’s possible there are subtle differences between them and they are two ever-so-slightly different branches of magic – e.g. perhaps aqua is more liquids in general and hydro is strictly related to water?

2. Maybe not ‘train’ themselves, but move beyond the need of runes – yes.

5. Answered earlier, but I see energy as a refined version of the raw anima, ideal for creating magic.

6. Pretty much, yes. And yes.

7. Most likely, yes.

9. Or they’re just not very rare in our universe?

10. This seems like an area ripe for discussion by the Lore Council…

17-Jan-2017 19:34:27

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Czar said:
7. The Vyre are difficult to fight because you either need silver and it's also stated a flail weapon is best, as they wouldn't be able to predict its randomness. How do the Vyre tell a person's action? Is it a natural ability, someone like instincts or is it an innate mind-reading skill?

Thanks.


I see it as a preternatural instinct, not mind-reading or magic of any form.

17-Jan-2017 19:35:31

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Ghostcaping said:
2. The Mahjarrat are obviously good with magic in general, but is there any lorey reason behind some having specific abilities while others don't? It's been made explicit that Khazard inherited his ability to manipulate the Shadow Realm from Palkeera, but Lucien didn't have a power over memories for Moia to inherit (unless her human mother, whoever she was, had the power and was somehow able to pass it on -- seems unlikely though). Is there something like dominant/recessive genes going on here, or are specialised Mahjarrat abilities not solely hereditary?

3. One of my favourite aspects of Dishonour Among Thieves was the multiple opportunities it gave me to insult Zemouregal, all of which I gladly took. Can you at least hint at whether the World Guardian will be able to insult Zemouregal further in upcoming quests? And seeing as I mentioned her in both of my other questions, can Moia get in on the insulting Zemouregal action? I bet she'd want to.


2. Mah’s creations all fall somewhere on a magical spectrum – Seren (light) and Zaros (dark) are towards the extremes and more singular in their make-up. I’d imagine that as Mah declined, she couldn’t help but to ‘mix the colours’ a little bit, ergo, inherently, some Mahjarrat are more inclined towards certain types of magic than others. Muspah are more generic as a result (differentiated only really by combat type, and now size). Whatever might have come after the muspah would have been the magical equivalent of the colour brown.

3. You’re free to insult Zemouregal to your heart’s content in Dimension of Disaster. Then, once you’re done, you can reset things so he forgets it all, and then insult him over and over again as if it were the first time.

17-Jan-2017 19:37:42

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Azros said:
1: According to the balance elemental in wgs it was at our funeral and the player was their friend, in memorial of guthix we learn that the balance elemental is made up of 5 people and 1 (a female) who is also a time traveler from our future and she is also a world guardian. Will more story come with this new world guardian?

2: In the memorial of guthix, guthix states that a "male" using the Amserdrwys came and spoke to him and told him of the events that will happen, (this is not the player as the player comes at the end of the 3rd age) Is this the beginning of a new story arc? will new quests come along with this story ?


1. Clearly them knowing you, and you not them, suggests some oddity. Time travel is one way this might be possible. There’s value in explaining this further – that’s all I’d say for the time being.

2. This is referring to the player’s visit in TLW. What about the Time engram makes you think it’s not also taken from this same period of time?

17-Jan-2017 19:38:21

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Lime, please.

Also...

Re: Emirs or Al Kharid:
They’re all bloodline descendants of the person who (re-)discovered the Kharid-ib in the ruins of (presumably long-buried) Kharid-et, and were instrumental in the founding and creation of Al Kharid.

Re: Spirit Realm/Plane and other such nonsense:
This is a personal bugbear of mine, but I view all of the Spirit this-that-and-the-others as the same thing, just given different names by different developers over the years. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but it creates confusion. They can still have their unique traits (e.g. pockets of spiritual existence within a greater, encompassing spirit plane). Except the Shadow Realm, that sits askew, and the Underworld, which sits below (if it has a relative geographical location). Clear? Good.

Re: dragonkin enemies:
Okay, so, they had no enemies (other than themselves…then Jas), being the only mortal beings in existence at that time. There were *probably/possibly* non-sentient creatures, some of which *might* have been dangerous to them. They’ve most definitely changed as a result of their fate.

Re: the previous cycle's universe:
There was no one there to ‘have’ magic, except dragonkin, and they naturally breathe fire so perhaps had no magic either. It would certainly have been less chaotic and more quiet.

Re: magic in previous cycles:
It’s been the same in every revision, it being (until recently) the sole preserve of the elder gods (though refined over the years as they strove towards perfection).

Re: Tumeken's explosion/split thing:
First off, power level does not strictly dictate what each god can and cannot do. They are not limitations, rather what typically becomes possible throughout the tiers and when. There are exceptions to every rule, however. Also, more on this later… I can’t see him ever being on the same tier as Zaros, but he’d have had to have been quite adept to have fended him and his empire off for so long.

Re: the strange machinery in the Smoking Kills dungeon:
*shrugs* I think it was just nice scenery, telling an environmental story of that dungeon. There’s no plan for it outside of personal head-canon.

Re: the existence of the "Western Lands":
Are not all lands both eastern and western in relation to other lands?

Re: golems:
Golem are inanimate constructs (of clay, bamboo, etc) animated by magic/enchantments, and tasked by some fantastical interpretation of programming. Vorago is an anima construct, not a golem, although now you mention it, yes there are some parallels here, just that one of them isn’t made by mortals (e.g. your basic golem) or gods (e.g. the Saradomin colossus).

Re: using the enchanted key on Jas:
It would be like pouring a boiling kettle of water into an active volcano. Both are hot to us.

Re: the 'fact' that Gielinor is the centre of the universe:
Facts? I’m pretty sure we’ve stated that Gielinor and Freneskae are at opposite ends of the universe (which doesn’t necessarily suggest where its centre might be).

Re: when Amascut returned to Gielinor:
Indeed, when DID she return to Gielinor? Has that been stated anywhere in-game? I don't believe so... What was she up to?

17-Jan-2017 19:45:47

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
CD_Paladin_C said:
1)So did DoD Guthix kill the other gods instead of banishing them? (Wish I could draw, would draw this epic version of Armadyl petrified with the sword of edicts impaled through him)

3)Any chance of us getting a stone of jas timeline that shows who it passed between?

4)Just wanted to point out that The Light Within cutscene between Zaros and Seren always struck me as a lorefail that they weren't in their simulacrum forms, doubt they'd know what dresses, robes, and runic symbols were on an empty planet in the middle of no where space.


1) No, he drained them of the majority of their divinity, then kicked them out, so they wouldn't cause trouble trying to get back in.

3) Maybe...

4) Perhaps that was just the viewer's interpretation based on how they know them to look, or it was an editor making them more decent. I agree, perhaps their true forms make more sense, but it hasn't been established when exactly they decided to wear clothes. A full suit of armour would help Zaros isolate himself even from Seren. I wouldn't see it as a lorefail, in that case. It doesn't NOT fit with each of their characters.

17-Jan-2017 19:50:50

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Swolllliosis said:
Please answer as much as possible. They are ordered by most important.

2. What's the deal about the desert gods and the animal aspects? Tumeken = hawk, Elidinis = hippo, etc.? Is Tumeken an Aviansie?

3. Mod Osbourne said in a reddit post that there was an elder artefact somewhere in the Kharidian Desert. Is that still true? And is it the one Tumeken used to ascend?

5. Can you tell us anything about the the Kharid-ib at all?

6. Was Ful the only other Elder God other than Jas to create an elder artefact? Or did Wen and Bik also create a few of the twelve artefacts? (The Kiln)

7. Is Mah's ritual marker in Children of Mah considered a brand new Elder Artefact?

8. What does the Elder Horn actually do? Is it some kind of special mouthpiece like the mouthpieces Jas used to communicate with us in Sliske's Endgame? Is it used to communicate with divine energy-based races like seacreatures and Tokhaar?

11. Are vampyres considered undead?


2. Tumeken is not an aviansie.

3. I have no idea what he was referring to at the time.

4. I wouldn't ever expect to see them, so if/when they do show up it will be a surprise.

5. I imagine you'll learn more along with Menaphos. Failing that, by the conclusion of the desert quest series.

6 and 7. I’d imagine the other two created tools also. Mah wouldn’t have, and her marker is not one.

8. At least one use for the Elder Horn is ‘to communicate with/control’, which is the basis for Quin’s ability to bend sea monsters to her will.

11. Vampyres are canonically not undead, they are a species.

Edit: corrected numbering.

17-Jan-2017 19:53:11 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2017 14:10:40 by Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Shadoliax said:
11) What are your plans (if any) to integrate the Tower of Life into modern lore?

12) Could divination be used to get lore on dead gods other than Guthix?

13) Is it a canon possibility for GWD bosses to be permanently killed?

17) Where does Menaphos get its food from?

18) How did the Skulls end up in both Draynor and the Wushanko islands? What is the history of the gang?


11. For my money, I’d retcon it, similar to how Osborne feels about Camelot. (Sorry, Tim.) It’s more that we’ve refined the game’s lore as a whole in recent years, and it just doesn’t fit in anymore. Before, it was a standalone curio.

12. It already has been with elder chronicles (Mah and the elders), Bandos chronicles, and even for a dragonkin.

13. With a need to not remove that gameplay, if this ever happened, those generals would need to replaced with a new character that (presumably) looks different, but acts in the exact same way. That’s messy, and it effectively nullifies any weight that death could have. IF the content were being deleted anyway, then it might be worthwhile killing off such characters, but only if a story demands and earns that death.

17. Food stores, locally grown produce and fishing, trade with the Eastern Lands…

18. They began in the Skull region (hence their name) and operate throughout (mainly) the first three regions of the Eastern Lands. There are trade links between Menaphos and the EL, so many ships ripe for taking as prizes. They’re also mercenaries (make money where they can) and were in Draynor initially for a contract there. It’s also good to have a base on operations on the mainland for smuggling goods) – it’s close to Port Sarim, but not as strictly governed.

17-Jan-2017 19:57:00

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Lord Drakan said:
Mm, all right.

4) Where in RuneScape is the Dragonkin Castle?

8) Lorefail of the Week: River of Blood mentions Ivandis invented Guthix Balance after the Battle of the Salve, even though he is known to have used it during the war. Is this intentional or will it be rectified?

9) When exactly would Amascut have eradicated the four lesser gods? Fourth Age most likely, but anything specific?


4. Which dragonkin castle? Presuming the one in Tale… in Bob/Robert’s flashback, I believe that’s intended to be the ruins in deep north-east Wilderness.

8. Don’t jump straight to assuming lorefail, it may just be conflicting sources. Consider the in-game source (not us). Where is it stated (and so who wrote) that he used them during the war, and is that from a reliable author? Does it specify WHICH war (e.g. pre-or-post-vampyrism)? Try not to make assumptions or have rigid thinking. (Though, if you say where you feel there is incorrect information, I’ll take a closer look and, if need be, correct it.)

9) Fourth Age sounds about right to me. Beyond the order, I don’t feel it’s important to state specific dates.

17-Jan-2017 19:59:42

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Cavi said:
3) In the latest Twitch stream it was mentioned that the Menaphos expansion wouldn't require the Sophanem quests but maybe a miniquest. Wouldn't this make the Sophanem quests inconsistent?
Couldn't you just give players an incentive to get the skill requirements like you did with Priffdinas (crystal amulet) and Children of Mah (Empty Throne room)?

Also, the Memorial of Guthix memories were beautifully written. Great job to whoever wrote them.


This isn't going to be a lore answer, but I feel it's worth covering here.

First off, nothing has been decided yet. We are still very much designing the update (parts of it are already in development, but it's how Scrum works that you design and refine as you go).

Requirements for entry are one of the things we have yet to determine. It is poor design practice to make assumptions - they should be challenged, if for no other reason than to reaffirm them.

We did the same thing with Prifddinas and the Arc, but neither of those ended up with no/low requirements to partake in their content. They are proof that we are not afraid to lock substantial content behind lots of requirements and high levels.

While it is true that a number of desert quests talk of Menaphos's gates being "closed to all" and events like Sophanem's citizens only returning after the Contact! quest, there are any number of ways that we could make narrative sense of the player being allowed access and not contradict existing content, even with no dialogue rewrites necessary. That is not to say this is what we WILL do - as I said, entry requirements have not yet been finalised, only discussed.

17-Jan-2017 20:12:16

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Lynxlynx said:
Will the Desert quest serie move on to The Sixth age, or will it keep going in The Fifth age?


This is an interesting question, and one of the assumptions I have recently been challenging. Currently, the series is not denoted as being 5th Age (I was surprised by that - again, my assumption). My gut instinct was to resolve the story within the 5th Age (or at least keep it Age-agnostic). I would only make it 6th Age if there were a plot point improved by doing that.

It would help to keep Iccy as your friend, as he's been in the 6th Age quest series, from how standoffish he was in Ic's Little Helper.

17-Jan-2017 20:22:54

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Amascut said:
1) Why were the origins of Amascut and Icthlarin changed with Sliske's Endgame? It feels like the two gods went from a fairly unique backgrounds with a special origin, to just another generic set of ascended gods. Now they don't even have justification for why they are considered a different type and tier of god.

5) What Elder Artefact is in the Desert?


Iccy and Ammy's origins haven't been changed; you've been given another piece of the puzzle. I can't really say anything here...er... Wait for Menaphos (where hopefully we can reveal more) or later desert quests. Their origin is unique among the gods, though rings true with how...no, not saying any more here, sorry.

I don't know there is one in the desert; that's something Osborne said, but I've no idea what he was referring to.

17-Jan-2017 20:28:06

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Syrus Coy said:
Could we have more Akthanakos/Camel lore when Menaphos is released?


The story of Menaphos is the story of the desert pantheon. Camels may feature, but not in any great detail.

17-Jan-2017 20:30:29

Mod Rowley

Mod Rowley

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user
Go to go, sorry. You can always tweet me specific questions @JagexRowley. If I've skipped over questions related to desert lore, it might just be because we're working on the Menaphos project... ;)

17-Jan-2017 20:41:15

Quick find code: 341-342-691-65870907Back to Top