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Remove all stone spirits

Quick find code: 15-16-352-66076211

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Madman911
Feb Member 2012

Madman911

Posts: 1,560Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
What a waste.

They don't sell in GE because no one wants them. We don't want to waste time high alch them.

Really...you go to god bosses and you get coal stone spirits?

Make us wonder what is the point of beta testing if you don't listen to our suggestions.

16-Jan-2019 02:21:08

Shooter Mann

Shooter Mann

Posts: 281Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
markets irrelevant. they have no value, no one wants them, no one buys them, they dont sell for 1gp most of the time ive listed them.

all they did was make killing monsters less profitable.

16-Jan-2019 07:10:55

Spiff Capt
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2013

Spiff Capt

Posts: 1,390Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I have to disagree.

Sure we all have grown up with (combat) monsters & bosses dropping skilling supplies. But from a skilling balancing point of view, I have always found it very unfair. You go for an hour of Twin Furies you collect 1.5k coal, while i have never seen those bosses in the mining guild or seen them doing any underground work. Nor have i seen any adventurers bring a supplie of coal to a boss, only to leave the coal to the bosses when they would die. Gp drops & armour pieces on the other hand are more logical to be carrying around, and lose.

What i mean is, bosses don't really have a reason to drop us skilling items. And now they do a lot less. They encourage us to go skilling. To explore the wide palet of skills that are in runescape. Players that aren't that much into skilling will have to drop a part of the profits, by selling the spirits, at a (logically) lower price than the actual xp gaining activity.

Sure the monster drops could have been updated to reflect the old values of the drops, like rune ores being replaced by dark or light spirits. As 10 rune ore drops nowadays is just 1-2 minutes of mining. Before the update it would at least take 3x 12mins on a single world/triple ore location. 1-2 minutes of mining can't be compared to the 1-2 minutes of dangerous combat & supplies it takes to take down a medium boss.
But a rebalancing in that matter might have been too much work to include it into this rework update.

-- Spiffy --

16-Jan-2019 08:15:02 - Last edited on 16-Jan-2019 08:17:31 by Spiff Capt

Uncle Pob

Uncle Pob

Posts: 2,962Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Shooter Mann said:
markets irrelevant. they have no value, no one wants them, no one buys them, they dont sell for 1gp most of the time ive listed them.

all they did was make killing monsters less profitable.

There is some truth in that.

As a Skiller I have yet to buy any Stone Spirits from the GE. Why is this?

As a Skiller I prioritize XP gains over GP profits. Stone Spirits do help Skillers gather ores quicker, but that isn't helpful to me: ores don't give me XP, doing mining does. When I'm doing mining, I want to be out there for as long as possible gathering XP. The quicker my ore box and the rest of my backpack fills up, the faster I have to bank all that and move on to the next ore.

Doing that, without Stone Spirits I get decent XP rates I'm happy with, along with enough ores to spend some time training Smithing too. If I had about 80 Stone Spirits for each of the types of ore that I mine, I'd only gather half as much XP in Mining before getting the same amount of ores to train my Smithing. If I used Porters with Stone Spirits, I'd end up with a rediculous stockpile of ores and have to spend many hours Smithing nonstop to use them all up and be able to go back to Mining.

So long story short, Stone Spirits are counterproductive for me.

But then, I'm level 119 Smithing and 106 Mining, which explains why I need Mining XP far more than I need Smithing XP. If I mined until I was 120 Mining, I'd already have enough ores to get to 120 Smithing - so why would I need more?

So in order to nullify the XP shortage I'd have by taking Stone Spirits with me, the Stone Spirits would need to counter that via an XP bonus of some kind when they're used. That way I wouldn't feel like I'm just doing less Mining to end up with less Mining XP if I used Stone Spirits, and they'd speed-up the entire process meaning I might be inclined to always have a stack of Stone Spirits with me while I mine.

But Jagex said they won't do that already.

16-Jan-2019 10:49:13 - Last edited on 16-Jan-2019 10:50:40 by Uncle Pob

Uncle Pob

Uncle Pob

Posts: 2,962Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
The more I see complaints by PvMers about Stone Spirits, the more I'm inclined to agree with them, and want them gone: no need to replace them on the drop-tables, and of course the boss-drop tables would need to be rebalanced to ensure that high-value drops don't drop more frequently due to the removal of low-grade drops that previously diluted the tables.

Of course, all you'll notice is you wouldn't be getting Stone Spirits any more. Your GP per hour wouldn't improve, it would just solidify current economic conditions preventing the possibility of Stone Spirits increasing in value at any point....

16-Jan-2019 11:00:35

Spiff Capt
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2013

Spiff Capt

Posts: 1,390Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Uncle Pob said:
Shooter Mann said:
markets irrelevant. they have no value, no one wants them, no one buys them, they dont sell for 1gp most of the time ive listed them.

all they did was make killing monsters less profitable.



So in order to nullify the XP shortage I'd have by taking Stone Spirits with me, the Stone Spirits would need to counter that via an XP bonus of some kind when they're used. That way I wouldn't feel like I'm just doing less Mining to end up with less Mining XP if I used Stone Spirits, and they'd speed-up the entire process meaning I might be inclined to always have a stack of Stone Spirits with me
[/quote]

I guess it would be good to have a toggle like the workings of the spring cleaner & dwarven chainaxe/fish extractor/ramhammer, to either convert to bxp or to receive double ores. This doubles the potential, and therefor fills in the demand faster.

-- Spiffy --

16-Jan-2019 11:04:07

XSlay4DeathX
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2007

XSlay4DeathX

Posts: 1,305Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Spiff Capt said:
I have to disagree.

Sure we all have grown up with (combat) monsters & bosses dropping skilling supplies. But from a skilling balancing point of view, I have always found it very unfair. You go for an hour of Twin Furies you collect 1.5k coal, while i have never seen those bosses in the mining guild or seen them doing any underground work. Nor have i seen any adventurers bring a supplie of coal to a boss, only to leave the coal to the bosses when they would die. Gp drops & armour pieces on the other hand are more logical to be carrying around, and lose.

What i mean is, bosses don't really have a reason to drop us skilling items. And now they do a lot less. They encourage us to go skilling. To explore the wide palet of skills that are in runescape. Players that aren't that much into skilling will have to drop a part of the profits, by selling the spirits, at a (logically) lower price than the actual xp gaining activity.

Sure the monster drops could have been updated to reflect the old values of the drops, like rune ores being replaced by dark or light spirits. As 10 rune ore drops nowadays is just 1-2 minutes of mining. Before the update it would at least take 3x 12mins on a single world/triple ore location. 1-2 minutes of mining can't be compared to the 1-2 minutes of dangerous combat & supplies it takes to take down a medium boss.
But a rebalancing in that matter might have been too much work to include it into this rework update.

-- Spiffy --


Reason monsters have skilling supplies was to decrease demand, unless you want skilling to lose more gp per hour? Takes someone 1 hour to wc 300 or so yews(not 100% correct but close I never wced yews but I know there slow). Tbh most skills don't make that much anyways, coal is going to drop in value, no point mining it and it's demand got removed, if you want gp from skilling just runecraft without runespan or afk an armour set with new smithing and PvM :)

16-Jan-2019 11:14:18

Spiff Capt
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2013

Spiff Capt

Posts: 1,390Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
XSlay4DeathX said:


Reason monsters have skilling supplies was to decrease demand, unless you want skilling to lose more gp per hour? Takes someone 1 hour to wc 300 or so yews(not 100% correct but close I never wced yews but I know there slow). Tbh most skills don't make that much anyways, coal is going to drop in value, no point mining it and it's demand got removed, if you want gp from skilling just runecraft without r
[/quote]

Ideally if skilling supplies are put on the droptable they should not be generated by the server, they should come straight from the G.E. offers (med price). Make the monsterdrop have for example a value of 50k-80k, let the server calculate this into a coal (spirits) amount (at current prices), then drop this amount of coal for the fighting player. And pull these amounts for current offers. This way, no ghosted coal gets created, the fighting player gets the same value each drop. If in the long run the item still reaches a 1gp/item value, then it means there are balace issues in the skill (either too much entering (gathering skill), or too little leaving (artisan skill) the game). But at least no extra supplies would enter the game artificially.

-- Spiffy --

16-Jan-2019 11:45:21 - Last edited on 16-Jan-2019 11:48:27 by Spiff Capt

a Failure
Jul Member 2005

a Failure

Posts: 1,590Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
This is an example of game-damaging content deployment. The resource drops (bars, ores, etc) should have been replaced with coins of equal value.

The stone spirits, if needed at all, should have been put into NPC stores and kept at 10% discount off the GE price of their corresponding ores.

This would keep cash and items flowing in the right directions on the economic pyramid, and people at all levels could benefit as desired from the spirits.

16-Jan-2019 13:45:27

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