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Comp cape without reaper fix

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Kcin
Aug Member 2008

Kcin

Posts: 13,685Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Nex is Life said:

Guess you cheesed it with sinkholes and dailies then.

Wrong again, solo dungs all the way, solo smalls floor 30+ rushing anything below. Maybe you should stick to the argument instead of trying for an ad hominem.
Nex is Life said:

RuneScape is an MMO. Note the second M. Not sure why you think group content should be shunted.

Just because it is a MMO doesn't mean everything has to be Multiplayer *cough* telos arraxor *cough*

Nex is Life said:

Maybe. But DG can be 100% leeched, guess it shouldn't be a comp req?

Difference between raids and DG, dung can be soloed, raids can't.

Nex is Life said:

There isn't any kind of barrier between leeching and enjoying experiencing content when it comes to unlocking a cape, but it's better than completely avoiding said content.

Being a leecher who stands in a corner isn't enjoying the experience nor actually experiencing the content so again it doesn't matter if its a leecher or not doing the content they are the same in this case.

Nex is Life said:

lol no. It should be a prestigious and hard to get cape.

And shouldn't rely on other people get a cape only you can wear

Nex is Life said:

MQC is for finding all lore, finding post-quest content, reading books scattered throughout the game it's not a "stuff left out of comp cape" cape.

In most games completing the story is beating the game. In a role playing game story is the main game. Maybe you forgot what the MMORPG stands for. Maybe I should put it in your words: Nex is Life said:
guess every requirement you don't like should be taken off? lol no.


So why should the story aspect not be a part of comp but a group boss should.
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04-Mar-2018 17:21:33 - Last edited on 04-Mar-2018 17:22:05 by Kcin

Nex is Life
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2016

Nex is Life

Posts: 1,884Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kcin said:

Wrong again, solo dungs all the way, solo smalls floor 30+ rushing anything below

Just because it is a MMO doesn't mean everything has to be Multiplayer

Difference between raids and DG, dung can be soloed, raids can't.

Being a leecher who stands in a corner isn't enjoying the experience nor actually experiencing the content

And shouldn't rely on other people get a cape

In most games completing the story is beating the game.
So why should the story aspect not be a part of comp but a group boss should.

I didn't say there was anything wrong with the sinkholes/dailies way. Solo smalls all the way on the other hand, what a waste of time.

I didn't say that solo content shouldn't exist, my point was group content is a huge part of the game.

Missed my point again. You can participate in raids, or leech it. You can participate in DG, or leech. Why should someting not be a requirement just because it CAN be leeched, and why does that apply to PvM but not DG?

Yes they are the same, and the comp cape requirements list can't tell whether you leeched or enjoyed content. That doesn't mean that something shouldn't be a requirement. As my point above, how can your cape tell whether you stood in the starting room of a dungeon until others finished it?

You're not relying on others, your problem is YOU can't play your part in a group.

I don't disagree about story, and yes all lore could be put into comp in my opinion. That said completing the story is doing all quests and minigames/extras. Reading a book about a character's origin isn't necessarily essential to complete the plot involving them.

If completing the game is completing the story, what does skilling have to do with that? Maybe I should part it in your words:
So why should the pvm aspect not be a part of comp but maxing should.
At least bosses have lore behind them.

For the record I do think maxing should be a requirement
You'll get it when you deserve it.

04-Mar-2018 17:58:10

Kcin
Aug Member 2008

Kcin

Posts: 13,685Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Nex is Life said:

I didn't say there was anything wrong with the sinkholes/dailies way. Solo smalls all the way on the other hand, what a waste of time.

We are on a MMORPG called Runescape, no one can call what others do on this game a waste of time. Its all pixels.

Nex is Life said:
my point was group content is a huge part of the game.

But it isn't anywhere near what Solo content is, hell we have 2 modes that are solo only for the entire game and they have access to nearly the whole game. So no group content isnt a huge part of the game.

Nex is Life said:
. Why should someting not be a requirement just because it CAN be leeched, and why does that apply to PvM but not DG?

Because DG can be done solo, a group boss cannot. Talk about missing points.


Nex is Life said:
That doesn't mean that something shouldn't be a requirement.

Missed the point again. What is the difference between having someone get comp cape through leeches not doing anything with the boss, or someone who got comp without the boss req. There is none.

Nex is Life said:

You're not relying on others

Ad hominem again tsk tsk. Relying on others to be able to complete a boss eg even starting the encounter is relying on them no matter how good you think you are.

Nex is Life said:
Reading a book about a character's origin isn't necessarily essential to complete the plot involving them.

Beating a boss once with other people isn't either yet ones a req that has no real meaning in the game, and another is actual lore.

Nex is Life said:

If completing the game is completing the story, what does skilling have to do with that?

Forget MMORPG again? Has many aspects, lore, pvm, skilling. If you limit what one puts into a cape then you can limit what the others do.
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04-Mar-2018 18:10:46

Nex is Life
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2016

Nex is Life

Posts: 1,884Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kcin said:

we have 2 modes that are solo only

Because DG can be done solo, a group boss cannot.

Missed the point again. What is the difference between having someone get comp cape through leeches not doing anything with the boss, or someone who got comp without the boss req. There is none.

Ad hominem again tsk tsk. Relying on others to be able to complete a boss eg even starting the encounter is relying on them no matter how good you think you are.

Beating a boss once with other people isn't either yet ones a req that has no real meaning in the game, and another is actual lore.

Forget MMORPG again? Has many aspects, lore, pvm, skilling. If you limit what one puts into a cape then you can limit what the others do.

But Ironmen can do group PvM, proof of it's importantance.

My point was about leeching.

You missed the point again. What is the difference between having someone get comp cape through leeches not doing anything in DG, or someone who got comp without DG. There is none.
And I'm saying both group PvM and DG should be on there, not that either shouldn't.

Other people have no problem with group bosses, so the problem IS with people who can't get reaper done. Blaming others, blaming teams, calling the entire pvm community toxic and unbearable are the ways people deflect from their personal inability to do the boss.

Many bosses drop lore books, which you have said are a part of the story - I agree; other than that here is a good example.
Telos. Is awoken by the raging battle in GWD2, and rises from the Heart to destroy the Gielinor, but is stopped by the World Guardian. Fun fact, they scrapped a cutscene of it destroying the world if you die.
Obviously is doesn't apply to everything, like Giant Mole, but the player defeating all the big bads is a part of the story. If you complain that I didn't bring up a group PvM example I'll starting writing about all the lore behind the Liberation of Mazcab.
You'll get it when you deserve it.

04-Mar-2018 18:44:12

Steelweaver
Sep Gold Premier Club Member 2015

Steelweaver

Posts: 11,706Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I mean, other people having no problem with group bosses just shows that they managed to find a group to do it, not necessarily that they even did the boss in the first place.

It's obviously not true, but lets propose that every single person with a Completionist Cape had leeched their group boss kills or had to pay a fee to sit in a corner and do nothing, regardless of the difficulty of finding a group to do it or not.

Would that, in any way, make the Reaper title a good requirement for the cape?
In a requirement sense, yes.
In a "this is quality gameplay" sense, most people would say no.


Proposing a more realistic situation, 50% of the people who want to earn a Completionist Cape (lets just say 1,000 people for simplicity) have the gear and means to do so outside of finding _ more people who want to do those bosses.


As they said on the livestream, a Completionist Cape doesn't necessarily have to mean you've done everything ever, but it should mean you've put your feet in the water in most of the content in the game.

The problem that's arising for many people (and Jagex included, as it's convoluting the definition of this Completionist Cape) is that once we get past Solak (as Solak appears to be the last boss in terms of "high tier PvM" for many people), we're potentially going to see bosses that are in the playing field of being completed only by the top 0.1% of PvMers, the true hardcores, not just the general PvMers and Completionist Hunters. At least, that's the way it seems it's going to go with the demands of the PvM community.

While a Completionist should have dabbled in a majority of the game, should it also be tied with being part of the top 0.1% of the playerbase?



While it is a lofty goal and rightful so, I think people can agree (maybe not you) that if you've done a wide slew of content, tying the cape to doing something so obviously restricting is problematic.
The Steelweaver

World Guardian #835
Maxed 9/7/2016
120 Smithing 1/4/2019

04-Mar-2018 19:05:18 - Last edited on 04-Mar-2018 19:05:53 by Steelweaver

Kcin
Aug Member 2008

Kcin

Posts: 13,685Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Nex is Life said:

But Ironmen can do group PvM, proof of it's importantance.

The point, you missed it again. If it was a MMORPG where you had to interact with the multiplayer aspects for everything that would be a solo piece of content, ironman mode would never exist. So ironman exist, so can a comp cape where group bosses aren't required to get it.
Nex is Life said:

My point was about leeching.

Yet your argument is based on a flawed base. Dung can be soloed, group bosses can't, so the leeching aspect has no impact in that.

Nex is Life said:

You missed the point again. What is the difference between having someone get comp cape through leeches not doing anything in DG, or someone who got comp without DG.

The difference once again: Dung can be soloed by players
group bosses cannot.


Nex is Life said:

Other people have no problem with group bosses

Ever since reaper was announced as a comp req plenty of people have had a problem with group bosses as a req.

Nex is Life said:

Many bosses drop lore books, which you have said are a part of the story - I agree; other than that here is a good example.

Yeah and those should be required for an actual comp cape, but you do not unlock a lore story by killing a boss in a group of players so that is different. Again it seems like you are pick and choosing what you think should be on the comp cape.

Edit:
The fact that group bosses are toggleable to get in soul reaper shows Jagex knows the community has a problem with them for solo content,
[qfc id= 373-374-110-66042164]Support the small QoL updates[/qfc] Ever feel like you have a person who won't leave you alone even if you've asked many times?

04-Mar-2018 19:11:07 - Last edited on 04-Mar-2018 19:17:05 by Kcin

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