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Partnerships - Not About Money

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Arsonistick
Jul Member 2019

Arsonistick

Posts: 4Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
The news post seems to completely miss the point.

Partnership content and breaking the fourth wall ruin the immersion of a role-playing game. RuneScape is a MMORPG. That means both that it is MMO and RPG. Seeing scores to thousands of different players every day playing the same game as you, and yet completely different styles from you. Maybe they're a PKer, a skiller, an endgame-rusher or maxed player. They've played hours, days, years, going-on-two-decades. They can be anyone at this point as we've been international since time immemorial.

This means that anything that gets introduced will be used by someone eventually. So that orange skin, the saradomin book, the new old emotes. Those are all going to be seen by someone who enjoys it, wants to check it out, or generally wants to show off in your face.

Introducing some item you can only receive by being part of an outside club is including people in their own little clique from everyone else for a few months. They're no longer RuneScape players, they're a RuneScape player that also visits Reddit, or whatever sponsor wants to promote their site. This is breaking the fourth wall, bringing outside parties into the game to change the game with money. See new thing, think about money. See thing you can't have yet, think about money changing hands.

Don't bring anything into the game that only someone who paid money to someone else can receive. Don't let money continuously buy status independent of game effort. Don't bring in a skin for something that can only be acquired through things other than RuneScape.

If you want to have a partnership, great. Just don't change the live game because a company wants to put their money in your face as a lure.

05-Jul-2019 19:46:28

Dilbert2001
Jun Gold Premier Club Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 10,036Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Arsonistick said:

Don't bring anything into the game that only someone who paid money to someone else can receive. Don't let money continuously buy status independent of game effort. Don't bring in a skin for something that can only be acquired through things other than RuneScape.

If you want to have a partnership, great. Just don't change the live game because a company wants to put their money in your face as a lure.


Money is not necessarily a must to be involved in a partnership to benefit both sides.

Remember Book of Face? Nobody needs to pay Facebook a pence but they still brought BookFace (or Book of Face) into the game.

So, yes, partnership is not always about money. It can be established in some form of you-scratch-my-back-and-I-scratch-yours manner. :)

05-Jul-2019 19:56:49 - Last edited on 05-Jul-2019 20:06:09 by Dilbert2001

Arsonistick
Jul Member 2019

Arsonistick

Posts: 4Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Dilbert2001 said:


Money is not necessarily a must to be involved in a partnership to benefit both sides.

Remember Book of Face? Nobody needs to pay Facebook a pence but they still brought BookFace (or Book of Face) into the game.

So, yes, partnership is not always about money. It can be established in some form of you-scratch-my-back-and-I-scratch-yours manner. :)


That's still crossing the line, because it's an advertisement via promotion in the live game. Facebook isn't part of the RuneScape lore, it has no right to be in Gielinor. Starbucks has no place in Game of Thrones, Coca Cola doesn't belong in hockey, Twitch and its exclusive skin color has no place in RuneScape. Making advertisements natural and native in a game compromises its integrity.

There were/are advertisements above the game in f2p, not across the game screen or in the middle of gameplay. Advertisements and content should remain separate.

05-Jul-2019 21:09:29

Dilbert2001
Jun Gold Premier Club Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 10,036Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Arsonistick said:
Dilbert2001 said:


Money is not necessarily a must to be involved in a partnership to benefit both sides.

Remember Book of Face? Nobody needs to pay Facebook a pence but they still brought BookFace (or Book of Face) into the game.

So, yes, partnership is not always about money. It can be established in some form of you-scratch-my-back-and-I-scratch-yours manner. :)


That's still crossing the line, because it's an advertisement via promotion in the live game. Facebook isn't part of the RuneScape lore, it has no right to be in Gielinor. Starbucks has no place in Game of Thrones, Coca Cola doesn't belong in hockey, Twitch and its exclusive skin color has no place in RuneScape. Making advertisements natural and native in a game compromises its integrity.

There were/are advertisements above the game in f2p, not across the game screen or in the middle of gameplay. Advertisements and content should remain separate.


"It should be noted that ‘partnerships’ is not a ‘catch-all’ term – there are many types of commercial partnership opportunities, and as well the ones suggested in the poll, we’ve partnered in the past with the likes of Apple and Google, who have been pivotal in helping us bring Old School Mobile to you all in October last year. So, rather than Walmart or Pepsi, we would look to partner with companies who make sense to both us, yourselves and the game itself."


They are going to "cross the line" regardless. As I mentioned, Jagex would bring other monetisation initiatives to OSRS anyway. Not doing cosmetics actually might mean even more unpleasant things to some players being added there. You never know. O_o

05-Jul-2019 21:28:20

cooke fletch

cooke fletch

Posts: 1,759Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
So if they introduce a new weapon that can only be used by people that have done a certain quest, which is very difficult, then they are not doing the same thing? IF they introduce a new skill and have a weapon that requires that you have 95 in that skill, you are introducing something that only a tiny group can have for a time? It highly possible that a large portion of the players will never have 95 in that new skill. Stop being a entitled snowflake. If you want something in game, earn it rather than demand it be given to you.

06-Jul-2019 00:24:57

Notcool97
Dec Member 2016

Notcool97

Posts: 1,360Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
cooke fletch said:
So if they introduce a new weapon that can only be used by people that have done a certain quest, which is very difficult, then they are not doing the same thing? IF they introduce a new skill and have a weapon that requires that you have 95 in that skill, you are introducing something that only a tiny group can have for a time? It highly possible that a large portion of the players will never have 95 in that new skill.
It isn't the same thing at all. It doesn't matter if only a tiny group of players can get a certain item. What matters is how they get the item, ie what 'excludes' other players from getting it. If they unlock it via playing the game it is fine; if they unlock it only via spending rl money or performing some action for another company, then it is wrong and ruins the integrity of osrs.

It is fine to exclude people from certain content if they are bad at the game or simply haven't played the game enough to unlock it; it is an entirely different situation if you are excluding people from content based solely on their ability to pay rl money or perform activities outside the game.

06-Jul-2019 11:13:06

Angel2D4
Jun Member 2019

Angel2D4

Posts: 14,924Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Notcool97 said:
cooke fletch said:
So if they introduce a new weapon that can only be used by people that have done a certain quest, which is very difficult, then they are not doing the same thing? IF they introduce a new skill and have a weapon that requires that you have 95 in that skill, you are introducing something that only a tiny group can have for a time? It highly possible that a large portion of the players will never have 95 in that new skill.
It isn't the same thing at all. It doesn't matter if only a tiny group of players can get a certain item. What matters is how they get the item, ie what 'excludes' other players from getting it. If they unlock it via playing the game it is fine; if they unlock it only via spending rl money or performing some action for another company, then it is wrong and ruins the integrity of osrs.

It is fine to exclude people from certain content if they are bad at the game or simply haven't played the game enough to unlock it; it is an entirely different situation if you are excluding people from content based solely on their ability to pay rl money or perform activities outside the game.


They weren't offering something that would exclude ANYBODY.
They weren't offering something that required REAL money.

They were offering cosmetics that ANYONE could have obtained. WITHOUT spending one red cent.

Those involved with the partnership (spending rl money on something else) would have simply obtained the cosmetic BEFORE YOU did.

"I'm bad at the game so I'll buy lots of bonds with my rl money and get all the gp I could ever need, then buy every BIS item there is"

"oh, that's ok cause the money goes to jagex"

"IDGAF if the game gets new players, you will NOT get cosmetics a month before me cause you suck at the game!"

Y'all are just somethin' else.
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity" -Martin Luther King Jr.

06-Jul-2019 16:42:38

Notcool97
Dec Member 2016

Notcool97

Posts: 1,360Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@angel

Notcool97 said:
It isn't the same thing at all. It doesn't matter if only a tiny group of players can get a certain item. What matters is how they get the item, ie what 'excludes' other players from getting it. If they unlock it via playing the game it is fine; if they unlock it only via spending rl money or
performing some action for another company,
then it is wrong and ruins the integrity of osrs.

It is fine to exclude people from certain content if they are bad at the game or simply haven't played the game enough to unlock it; it is an entirely different situation if you are excluding people from content based solely on their ability to pay rl money or
perform activities outside the game
.
It's a good idea to make sure you have read my whole post before criticising one part of it in isolation. What they polled absolutely was excluding people: people that didn't participate in whatever their 'partner' company wanted. Eg I was 'excluded' from having purple skin for months because I didn't get twitch prime. So that was something ingame that I could not access soley due to the fact I didn't perform some activity outside the game (get a twitch prime subscription) for a completely different company (twitch). Do I need to define exclusion for you?

06-Jul-2019 17:14:57

Angel2D4
Jun Member 2019

Angel2D4

Posts: 14,924Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Notcool97 said:
@angel

Notcool97 said:
It isn't the same thing at all. It doesn't matter if only a tiny group of players can get a certain item. What matters is how they get the item, ie what 'excludes' other players from getting it. If they unlock it via playing the game it is fine;
if they unlock it only via
spending rl money or
performing some action for another company,
then it is wrong and ruins the integrity of osrs.

It is fine to exclude people from certain content if they are bad at the game or simply haven't played the game enough to unlock it; it is an entirely different situation
if you are excluding people from content based solely on
their ability to pay rl money or
perform activities outside the game
.
It's a good idea to make sure you have read my whole post before criticising one part of it in isolation. What they polled absolutely was excluding people: people that didn't participate in whatever their 'partner' company wanted. Eg I was 'excluded' from having purple skin for months because I didn't get twitch prime.
So that was something ingame that I could not access
soley due to the fact I didn't perform some activity outside the game (get a twitch prime subscription) for a completely different company (twitch). Do I need to define exclusion for you?


Your condescending tone aside.. You could NOT access it before someone else is NOT the same as not being able to access it. Your words are in firebrick above.

'waaahhhh I can't be the first one to get this!!' is just ... unbelieveably silly.
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity" -Martin Luther King Jr.

06-Jul-2019 17:28:29

Notcool97
Dec Member 2016

Notcool97

Posts: 1,360Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Angel2D4 said:
Your condescending tone aside.. You could NOT access it before someone else is NOT the same as not being able to access it. Your words are in firebrick above.

'waaahhhh I can't be the first one to get this!!' is just ... unbelieveably silly.
No. What is unbelievably silly is throwing a hissy fit because jagex refuses to make a no update server just for you and the five other people that want it, continuing to pay membership for the game you despise just so you can vote on things you believe will destroy it.

My position is nothing in the game should be locked, for any timeframe, based on any requirement that isn't osrs related. Your position is wanting the game to fail. The general rule is if Angel wants something added to the game, it is something that will ruin it so she gets what she wants: either a non update osrs, or no osrs at all.

06-Jul-2019 17:56:59

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