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We made us World Guardian?

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Sepulchre
Feb Member 2019

Sepulchre

Posts: 3,496Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
You ever wonder why we're so important? Why the Player Character is the chosen one of Guthix? Why we always appear in the right place at the right time when Trouble is Brewing (LOL)?
What if I told you the reason we're so important.. is because we made it that way?
I started to develop this theory after Dimension of Disaster was released, and I think I've gotten enough to finally open it up:

Thanks to DoD, I can safely say that this game exists in a multiverse. Just the basis of this quest also seems to imply that we live in a Quantum Multiverse, which is also known as the Many-worlds Interpretation. To make this simple, this means that there exist multiple dimensions in this game, each being brought upon when a major event happens in history, this is called a Quantum Event. Each time this happens, a major decision is made; When this happens, two realities are brought into existence. One where a choice was made, and one where the other choice was made instead.
How does this relate? Well, in the Many-worlds Interpretation, time travel is a rather tricky subject. It is mostly believed that when a person travels back in time, this is considered a Quantum Event, and thus creates a new world for that person.
Let's go back to a quest called Making History. In this quest we jump into the distant past, then very slightly into the closer past. We meet the first humans on Gielinor in their first and second generation, and help them to solve various problems. In doing so, we cause a Quantum Event, and as such are brought to a totally new world when we return to the "present," where we resembled a very important historical figure.
What I believe, is that this caused a Butterfly Effect, or a ripple in time that spread throughout history and changed certain events, specifically directed around us. We essentially become the centerpiece of this new world. But wait, there's more...
A
World Guardian
must learn to find
Balance
in themselves.
Only then can they
Control
themselves and forge their own
Fate.

27-Jun-2016 08:56:42 - Last edited on 27-Jun-2016 09:47:49 by Sepulchre

Sepulchre
Feb Member 2019

Sepulchre

Posts: 3,496Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
During the quest The Light Within, we once again travel into the past.. Quantum Multiverse says we're making another world. This time we do something a lot more important.. we tell Guthix that he already made us his successor.
I suppose now is a good time to pause and explain the inner workings of the Many-worlds Interpretation. When a change is made, only those direct changes are kept in a world that branches off from it, not the changes of a Butterfly Effect, as those are random to any world, and can't be influenced directly. When a person goes to a world created by themselves, they are the only one of themselves in that world.
That is to say, we entered a world where we were NOT originally the World Guardian. We didn't exist in that world, because the only us there was, well.. US. We stood before the Guthix of another world entirely, and told him of another future, where he died and made us his successor of sorts, and he felt his power in us. Except this wasn't HIS power, it was a different Guthix's power of a different world altogether.
When this happened, we changed that world. The Guthix of that world was never meant to die, but when we told him of this, he decided to take this path. Without us telling him this, we would've come back to the future in a world where we were a nobody.

In short, when we told Guthix this, we made it so that in this NEW new world we created, we were the World Guardian again.

TLDR: We went back in time and made ourselves important in a second world. We went back in time again and almost made ourselves a nobody again, then caused this third world we created to follow the second more closely. At the end of the day, we're only important because we made ourselves important in the past.

So... whatdya think?! Any theories of your own involving time-travel shenanigans?
A
World Guardian
must learn to find
Balance
in themselves.
Only then can they
Control
themselves and forge their own
Fate.

27-Jun-2016 08:56:52 - Last edited on 27-Jun-2016 09:48:36 by Sepulchre

Satans exile

Satans exile

Posts: 19Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I don't specifically remember the dialogue from that quest but I remember the chat options. I personally did tell Guthix I'm the World Guardian but there were other options too where you didn't tell him that.

Although your first example of Making History still counts, but the Guthix one in TLW doesn't, alteast IIRC.

27-Jun-2016 21:35:24

Solanumtinkr
Jul Member 2009

Solanumtinkr

Posts: 22,231Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
But a Quantum Multiverse that spawns endless branches would also require access to infinite energy. Where as I think it is far more likely that the local potential for branches is limited by potential access to it being able to morph or branch in the first place.. So how about Quantumly Adaptable Multiverse?

Its morphology changes to fit the events it's exposed to. So if you went back to shoot your grandfather, who is to say that your lineal timeframe is not still a straight line forward in experienced time. That the grandfather you "go back" to shoot is in fact the branch that comes to our universe. A Deja Vu grandfather rather than yours. As that event has already passed by.

Or minimal ripples in the past might be gotten over though, if it did not veer to far from the original timeline for it to get back on course to where you started out.

In that way getting back to our starting point after making all those ripples could have persuaded Guthix to make us his Guardian. Heck he might have known exactly what we were from the first moment we landed in his ...home? Telling him wouldn't matter. T2 has to be good from something lol.

Plus our jaunts into the past have not gone unnoticed.
The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
To the Manor Born QFC 185-186-367-65788716

27-Jun-2016 22:38:58

Ancient Drew
Nov Member 2018

Ancient Drew

Posts: 5,731Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Why did Guthix and Seren make the Enchanted Key, anyway? Wouldn't they know that it could wreck the universe? Unless Jas' presence stops that from happening, in which case keep her alive. Prepare for hell on RuneScape in Naval Cataclysm!

Pokemon battle? Friend Code: 4614-0426-2439

27-Jun-2016 22:44:52

AesirWarrior
Nov Member 2017

AesirWarrior

Posts: 1,051Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I've had this theory for a while actually... Minus the quantum thing. I saw it more as a bootstrap paradox/stable time loop thing where you can't actually change history, just cause it (Think Prisoner of Azkaban or Gargoyles)... Which in retrospect probably doesn't make sense considering what we did in Meeting History, but oh well.

It's fully possible to not mention being The WG at all during that sequence btw, but it's fully possible he could just sense it.


As for the enchanted key...I always headcanoned it so that Seren started to work on the enchanted key... After seeing us use the enchanted key. Seeing the key gave her hope that she could change the elves' problem, but it was deemed a failure because it was limited in its power.
-
I have noticed your kind does tend to blindly stumble forward towards danger simply because it exists. What is your word for that?
- We call it being a hero.

27-Jun-2016 23:24:20

Sepulchre
Feb Member 2019

Sepulchre

Posts: 3,496Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Solanumtinkr said:
Its morphology changes to fit the events it's exposed to. So if you went back to shoot your grandfather, who is to say that your lineal timeframe is not still a straight line forward in experienced time. That the grandfather you "go back" to shoot is in fact the branch that comes to our universe. A Deja Vu grandfather rather than yours. As that event has already passed by.

That seems more like a mix of the Many-worlds Interpretation and the Novikov Self-consistency Principle. Basically a "You can't change the past, anything that you did in the past has already happened." Except with a "Because you went to a parallel universe and killed a different version of your grandfather."
A
World Guardian
must learn to find
Balance
in themselves.
Only then can they
Control
themselves and forge their own
Fate.

28-Jun-2016 04:50:21

Sepulchre
Feb Member 2019

Sepulchre

Posts: 3,496Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Satans exile said:
I don't specifically remember the dialogue from that quest but I remember the chat options. I personally did tell Guthix I'm the World Guardian but there were other options too where you didn't tell him that.

Although your first example of Making History still counts, but the Guthix one in TLW doesn't, alteast IIRC.
True, but do you really think Guthix wouldn't sense what is almost literally 'a part of himself' inside us?
A
World Guardian
must learn to find
Balance
in themselves.
Only then can they
Control
themselves and forge their own
Fate.

28-Jun-2016 04:51:28

Baxtorian
Jul Member 2009

Baxtorian

Posts: 6,311Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Not sure if I caught it all right but I'll explain the way I see it.

The 2 quests are actually inconsistent when it comes to how time travel works. Yes, Making History did have us alter the world, whether it did create a new one or not, it doesn't really matter.
However, in TLW, our trip to the past changed nothing - we had already been there long before we left to get to that point.

My main point is Jagex didn't define time travel better than world's best scientists did:P

28-Jun-2016 14:25:43

Cthris

Cthris

Posts: 5,189Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Sep I looked over your theory and I found it to be valid, but others have raised valid issues so I hope I can address them for you.

One thing about real world universes to keep in mind is that they can be expressed as very very complex mathematical equations because universes are governed by mathematical laws, such as the various law of thermodynamics. The universe is basically an equation similar to 3 + 5 x (7 -3) +19 = 42. Obviously way more complex.

Now in a equation, all parts of it, from the answer, to the given numbers, to the un-added sums in the middle, exist all at the same time. It works the same way for time, all subsequent events exist in the same moment.

Should we be able to go back in time and change an event, which is actually 2 huge assumption, this would cause a change in the equation of the universe. Imagine it like this [3 + 5 x (7 -3) +19] + {1} = 43 with {1} being the changes the time traveler made. Since the universe of the time traveler already exist in its entirety, the time traveler would be creating a new universe by causing a new equation to be formed, and thus destroying the old universe because its equation/answer no longer exist.

This does solve your infinite energy problem that Solanumtinkr rased because the new universe would utilize the energy of the old universe to create itself. (Of course this relies on the assumption that the new universe has equivalent energy, or less energy than the first universe.)

Now I did mention that the old universe would be destroyed, and at first glance this would appear to be problematic for your theory. But keep in mind that universes exist in all of their entirety in regards to time, and that time only exist inside universes. This would mean that technically all versions of the original universe would exist in one moment, despite also being destroyed in that same movement.

28-Jun-2016 14:47:26

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