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Lore-wise, how powerful is PC?

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Iceey
Jan Member 2017

Iceey

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We are at least as powerful as a T7 God, there is no doubt about that. We were able to withstand and kill the Dark Lord and Bandos' Avatar which were both the equivalent of a T7. We are also able to stand toe to toe with most Mahjarrat which all have the power of a T7 God.

Arrav and Robert the strong were both able to go up against a Mahjarrat or kill a Dragonkin and Xenia said we were at least as powerful as them. We also were able to withstand the onslaught of an extremely powerful Dragonkin.


We ourselves probably could kill a god with the right stuff. I mean Guthix killed Skagoroth in one shot with the Elder Sword.

Azzandra also says he wasn't sure if we could even still be considered a human and that we were something far greater.

If I had to guess, we probably have at least the power of a T6 or T5 since Sliske is probably now within us.
Come the Sixth-Age, the world will need the World Guardian.

05-Aug-2017 15:09:18

AesirWarrior
Nov Member 2017

AesirWarrior

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Iceey said:
We are at least as powerful as a T7 God, there is no doubt about that. We were able to withstand and kill the Dark Lord and Bandos' Avatar which were both the equivalent of a T7. We are also able to stand toe to toe with most Mahjarrat which all have the power of a T7 God.

Arrav and Robert the strong were both able to go up against a Mahjarrat or kill a Dragonkin and Xenia said we were at least as powerful as them. We also were able to withstand the onslaught of an extremely powerful Dragonkin.


We ourselves probably could kill a god with the right stuff. I mean Guthix killed Skagoroth in one shot with the Elder Sword.

Azzandra also says he wasn't sure if we could even still be considered a human and that we were something far greater.

If I had to guess, we probably have at least the power of a T6 or T5 since Sliske is probably now within us.


Well, we had to use a Deus Ex Machina crossbow to defeat the Bandos avatar, the Dragonkin could one shot us if it weren't for the protective charm, and the Dark Lord was destroyed by the light (and even then remained as a crystal).
-
I have noticed your kind does tend to blindly stumble forward towards danger simply because it exists. What is your word for that?
- We call it being a hero.

05-Aug-2017 21:29:08

Ancient Drew
Nov Member 2018

Ancient Drew

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AesirWarrior said:
Iceey said:
We are at least as powerful as a T7 God, there is no doubt about that. We were able to withstand and kill the Dark Lord and Bandos' Avatar which were both the equivalent of a T7. We are also able to stand toe to toe with most Mahjarrat which all have the power of a T7 God.

Arrav and Robert the strong were both able to go up against a Mahjarrat or kill a Dragonkin and Xenia said we were at least as powerful as them. We also were able to withstand the onslaught of an extremely powerful Dragonkin.


We ourselves probably could kill a god with the right stuff. I mean Guthix killed Skagoroth in one shot with the Elder Sword.

Azzandra also says he wasn't sure if we could even still be considered a human and that we were something far greater.

If I had to guess, we probably have at least the power of a T6 or T5 since Sliske is probably now within us.


Well, we had to use a Deus Ex Machina crossbow to defeat the Bandos avatar, the Dragonkin could one shot us if it weren't for the protective charm, and the Dark Lord was destroyed by the light (and even then remained as a crystal).
Plus Robert the Strong was like 9 foot tall and used bane arrows to kill Dragonkin. And there's probably something with that panther of his too.

Also the Mahjarrat in general tended to be weakened by missing rituals or being put to sleep to reserve themselves. With Sliske, he turned to stone at the Endgame, so his power from the Catalyst had probably been depleted at that time, or infused into fragments that he had taken (hence the fragment rewards at the end of the quest).

There's no doubt that we're superhuman in terms of power, even without gifts that can kill or muffle gods. But I'm not really sure that we're actually stronger than them.
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05-Aug-2017 21:54:25

RiDaku
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2012

RiDaku

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Hguoh said:
Except that, given what we were presented with in SE (World Guardian mode), the World Guardian status can apply to any situation if the right unspecified conditions are met, just not the divine protection bit (which Jas can overcome).


Sliske's end goal was literally to assist in the destruction of Gielinor. That quest was in every sense of the word, an End Of The World scenario. What exactly are you saying? That you don't expect the World Guardian powers to activate in order to defeat something that's going to end the World that we're Guardianing? It's not "unspecified conditions" when the conditions are the title of the power. As CinemaSins would say, "Roll credits" at that point.
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26-Aug-2017 08:01:04

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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RiDaku said:
Sliske's end goal was literally to assist in the destruction of Gielinor. That quest was in every sense of the word, an End Of The World scenario. What exactly are you saying? That you don't expect the World Guardian powers to activate in order to defeat something that's going to end the World that we're Guardianing? It's not "unspecified conditions" when the conditions are the title of the power. As CinemaSins would say, "Roll credits" at that point.


To sound entirely heartless, the world was in very little danger. The danger was to the sapient life on it.

We've seen with prior God Wars that the planes they take place on still exist afterwards with minimal, if any, impact on the planes Anima. The greatest impact we've seen on a plane's Anima because of a God Wars is that of the Wilderness, but even that seems to have done so little overall as the Elder Gods slept right on through it. The second greatest appears to be that of Armadyl's weapon firing during WE2 (based on Vorago's response to Armadyl in SE), which, again, failed to stir the elders and only got Vorago somewhat peeved with Armadyl.

You'll recall that Sliske's plan was to cause another God Wars to wake the elders so that they'd destroy Gielinor and force the gods to fight amongst and for the other planes. To that end, why then didn't Xenia's attempt to drain Gielinor's Anima (which actually did ring the alarm bell for the Elders) also trigger the World Guardian power? In both cases, the result is the potential waking of the elder gods and the destruction of Gielinor and it's people.

But then comes the kicker. By the time our World Guardian powers actually decided to do anything, Sliske's plan had already fallen apart with the destruction of the SoJ. At the time, Sliske posed no direct threat to the existence of Gielinor anymore. Potentially he could have become a threat again, but he wasn't at the time.

26-Aug-2017 10:07:04

RiDaku
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2012

RiDaku

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The-.. the world was in.. very little danger? Do you know what it is that the Elder Gods do after they wake up? A hard reset on everything. We have a whole paragraph or two telling us how the Dragonkin fled to the Abyss to survive one of the Resets and then visited Jas asking to be spared, whereupon she bound them to the Stone. Sliske's plan was to wake all the gods up, but Jas is going to wake them up anyways so it doesn't matter if it failed.

Also, Xenia's attempt didn't require the World Guardian power activating. Nevermind that we never actually manage to catch up to her until it's too late, so that would be kind of silly just running around super-buffed only to do nothing but wait for Kipple to bring us to the next Mouth of the Elders. We have the powers of the World Guardian laid out for us. Resistance to Gods, and overwhelming strength when the world is in danger. Neither needed to take effect to "stop" Xenia.

Also, the Stone of Jas had served its purpose for the most part, because the God Wars that he was triggering already happened. Battle of Lumbridge, Bird and the Beast, the Countdown to his Endgame was the entire God Wars. Do you remember the part where he was keeping score of everybody who'd killed a god? What did you think that was? No, Sliske didn't stop being a threat. He was an Agent of Jas and he was helping her set up for the destruction of the world. World Guardian powers came full-force and we bopped him.

I also don't get it - You say the world wasn't in danger and only the sentience on it was, but then in the very next paragraph you admit Jas was bent on destroying the world. When you destroy a world, that doesn't mean just the things on it, and we have more than enough lore to know that the Elder Gods don't care about anything other than creating Anima farms that they can then drain dry and reset.
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26-Aug-2017 18:58:41

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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RiDaku said:
The-.. the world was in.. very little danger? Do you know what it is that the Elder Gods do after they wake up? A hard reset on everything.


Not true. As seen by the continued existence of Freneskae, the 'perfect' world of each cycle survives into the next revision. And based on the Elder Sword echo in the Memorial to Guthix, the perfect worlds of each cycle, though drained of life, continue to persist.

RiDaku said:
Sliske's plan was to wake all the gods up, but Jas is going to wake them up anyways so it doesn't matter if it failed.


Yes, and Xenia's plan was to starve the elder gods, and it started waking them up. Same effect despite the different intents.

RiDaku said:
Also, Xenia's attempt didn't require the World Guardian power activating. Nevermind that we never actually manage to catch up to her until it's too late, so that would be kind of silly just running around super-buffed only to do nothing but wait for Kipple to bring us to the next Mouth of the Elders. We have the powers of the World Guardian laid out for us. Resistance to Gods, and overwhelming strength when the world is in danger. Neither needed to take effect to "stop" Xenia.


Silly, yes, but if the power was truly activated by the world being in danger I'd still expect it to have been active. And we can't conclude that need is a necessary aspect to activate the power as, and I've already said this, Sliske no longer posed a threat to the world as his plan to escalate the God Wars to the point that the elder gods would wake had fallen apart with the destruction of the Stone of Jas.

26-Aug-2017 22:35:13

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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Furthermore, Sliske's competition was an abysmal failure. All of one god invited to participate in his competition actually died. Of his other participants, two fought a single battle prior to his competition, one finished off an elder god that was attempting to terminate her and her 'siblings,' one threw a competition with another, and one maybe killed a god created from an amalgam of spirits that posed a direct threat to his domain. Otherwise, you had two outside gods and three (2 if you chose Icthlarin over Death) outside factions that clashed for reasons outside of Sliske's game.

RiDaku said:
Also, the Stone of Jas had served its purpose for the most part, because the God Wars that he was triggering already happened. Battle of Lumbridge, Bird and the Beast, the Countdown to his Endgame was the entire God Wars.


The first happened before his competition and for reasons other than the Stone, I'll grant you the second, and the third involved god deaths and battles for reasons totally separate from the Stone. Also, from Sliske's Endgame:

Zaros: Sliske, you know what this will do. The stone in the hand of the World Guardian, a powerful mortal with ties to all the gods? It will lead to war. The gods will see it as a threat. Or they may feel they are strong enough to take it for themselves.
Sliske: That's rather the point though, isn't it!

Seren: But a war, Sliske, it would wake them. You must know that the elder gods sleep below us and you know what will happen if they wake!

Sliske: Of course I know! Why do you think I've orchestrated all of this? I want them to wake and I want Gielinor to be torn apart in the process!

Shortly thereafter, the Stone went boom. Safe to say, the Stone still had a purpose in Sliske's plan. And without it, his entire plan to wake the elders fell apart.

26-Aug-2017 22:44:16

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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RiDaku said:
No, Sliske didn't stop being a threat. He was an Agent of Jas and he was helping her set up for the destruction of the world.


Except his entire plan flopped massively before we fought him. If anything, us killing him set about Jas's wake up call to the other elders due to the loss of her 'agent.'

Voice of Jas: You intrigue me. Mortal life is unexpected. It is dangerous.
Player: Not always, there are good qualities as well. Like erm, love and peace and hope?
Voice of Jas: Meaningless. You are a question. I ask the sisters. They wake.

RiDaku said:
I also don't get it - You say the world wasn't in danger and only the sentience on it was, but then in the very next paragraph you admit Jas was bent on destroying the world. When you destroy a world, that doesn't mean just the things on it, and we have more than enough lore to know that the Elder Gods don't care about anything other than creating Anima farms that they can then drain dry and reset.


Again, Freneskae and the other past 'perfect worlds' still exist. The only thing that's changed is the removal of life and anima from them. And if the powers were concerned with the loss of Anima or life, again, it should have triggered when Xenia siphoned off a significant chunk of Gielinor's Anima. Heck if anything, considering the elder gods weren't going to wake up quickly until after Sliske's death and Sliske's plan to escalate into a full blown God Wars was now FUBAR-ed, the power shouldn't have triggered at all if the trigger was saving lives or Anima.

26-Aug-2017 22:53:58

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