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Spirit stones (drop table)

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Vandinite
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Vandinite

Posts: 93Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
So, there's a current problem with drop tables that a lot of people are aware of, especially pvm, which is that the drop table has had spirit stones introduced into it. The problem with this is that while they've had some time to stabilize now, they haven't. There were changes made, which were that higher tier stone spirits were dropped over lower tier ones for certain bosses, but their prices are unstable as well selling far under street mid. This cuts into the price of PVM drastically, as when you get a stone spirit drop, it's all you receive.

So I come to propose an idea, if Jagex isn't going to remove them from drop tables, that they remove them from the current ones and reserve them for newer content. The content i'm proposing is a new boss, which revolves around stones, maybe crystals on it, maybe references to stone spirits, not the point. But that either and/or a boss, monster is introduced which revolves specifically around these things including other unique items. As for other sources of these items on terms of drop table, such as crystal chests, I suppose there could be a stone chest implemented. There are stone chests in OSRS in fact, but i'm not trying to connect the two and if a decision like this were to be made, a newer, different chest than that should be implemented.

If spirit stones were to stabilize, this newer type of source or sources would be more so viable, but they've had some time to stabilize and haven't, so to make them a tolerable option for whoever wants to choose them, unique items would come into ploy there, and making sure they are made properly, not mundane. (such as monsters made for this) But as it is, it just cuts into profit too much, and takes up more space so that less decent items are dropped.
Change isn't going to come to you. Take control of your life.

08-Feb-2019 23:08:40 - Last edited on 25-Feb-2019 07:24:24 by Vandinite

Balgeroth
Jul Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Balgeroth

Posts: 17Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Yeha, same problem with the seed drops these days.. you kill nex, spent some money into supplies and get torstol seeds worth 4k as example. Another good example is arraxor with dwarf seeds..
They should rework the more difficult boss's drop tables.

If i do nex and get unlucky i'll get some sara brews, stone spirits and torstol seeds in that hour.
With the 800k from the instance plus the supplie costs, you make even loss sometimes, at a high tier boss :/
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09-Feb-2019 11:47:31

Vandinite
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Vandinite

Posts: 93Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
The problem with stone spirits (Kings) is that no matter what they stabilize at, it's not going to be a significant drop ever at the volume they give per monster. Every single possible stone spirit drop on the entire drop table is below 50k, most below 30k. If there were a sudden spike in their price, or over time spike in their price, it would not be that drastic of a jump to make these drops significant. Their price is only relative to a decent percentage lower than their original ores they are based on, that price which is under the ores will never be that massive. The main problem with them being at this low price, is that they did not take items away in the drop table. Originally, it was already significantly hard to get rare drops based on luck. However, one to two drops of stone spirits were added taking up space for your drop chance. This has equated to bosses losing 1-2 million in profit per hour, and even more for even higher end bosses on average as some YouTuber's have covered. If they want to keep them in, they should either remove some other already non-expensive items on already existing boss drop tables, or remove the stone spirits their selves, possibly taking on the suggestion I gave. It isn't fair because it's making all PVMers lose on massive profits, and it's making PVM incentives significantly less significant. Change isn't going to come to you. Take control of your life.

25-Feb-2019 07:28:12 - Last edited on 25-Feb-2019 07:31:28 by Vandinite

Kings Abbot

Kings Abbot

Posts: 3,605Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Stone spirits weren't added as you claim, they replace the ores. Chances of all the drops remain equal.
And in the case Jagex didn't replace ores by stone spirits, the ores would also be low in price since their levels lowered and competition is gone. Anyone could see that coming from miles away.
People complained they wanted a rework, Jagex gave it to them (and even started over because players weren't pleased with the first draft, but they were happy with the second), now that it's out people complain again. Why do people always complain?
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25-Feb-2019 12:15:52

XSlay4DeathX
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2007

XSlay4DeathX

Posts: 1,253Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Vandinite said:
The problem with stone spirits (Kings) is that no matter what they stabilize at, it's not going to be a significant drop ever at the volume they give per monster. Every single possible stone spirit drop on the entire drop table is below 50k, most below 30k. If there were a sudden spike in their price, or over time spike in their price, it would not be that drastic of a jump to make these drops significant. Their price is only relative to a decent percentage lower than their original ores they are based on, that price which is under the ores will never be that massive. The main problem with them being at this low price, is that they did not take items away in the drop table. Originally, it was already significantly hard to get rare drops based on luck. However, one to two drops of stone spirits were added taking up space for your drop chance. This has equated to bosses losing 1-2 million in profit per hour, and even more for even higher end bosses on average as some YouTuber's have covered. If they want to keep them in, they should either remove some other already non-expensive items on already existing boss drop tables, or remove the stone spirits their selves, possibly taking on the suggestion I gave. It isn't fair because it's making all PVMers lose on massive profits, and it's making PVM incentives significantly less significant.


Indeed, they need fixed.

22-Mar-2019 22:58:52

Vandinite
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Vandinite

Posts: 93Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Yes, and no King. For one that's a fair point and an important thing for me to get wrong, I didn't remember ore in the confusion. However, which boss are you mentioning? Queen black dragon originally dropped 16 things via main drop table, including 3 ores, but now drops 17 different things, with four ore spirits. But then in bosses where there haven't been extra drops added to the table, the distinction to be made is a comparison of the two which was (then) for nex by example, coal (189,600 per drop of) and runite ore (103,040 per drop of), versus the now lumanite (58,080) and runite (76,240 per drop of) stone spirits, notice the distinction there for such a high-tier boss relatively speaking. Do note that by now, well over a month, these stone spirits have stabilized. Change isn't going to come to you. Take control of your life.

28-Mar-2019 23:58:55

Vandinite
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Vandinite

Posts: 93Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Why to people complain? Since when was I attacking the update in the entirety. Even if others suggest it, there is fair criticism in everything, why can't you accept that fair criticism will exist especially in a game that is being developed for others to purchase? Do you not understand that games are subject to review as a product for others, not to mention that they are capitalizing on it? Inb4, they can take suggestions and ad content accordingly, but at the end of the day the content that was added generally with these big updates was not completely created by the suggestions made and the developers were the one who developed further on the vague suggestion of, "mining rework". Does that not make sense to you? It should.

Let's put it this way, we want a rework on mining =/= replace ores with some items we came up with being spirit stones, here's a bunch of names for the spirit stones and new mineable ores, here's the ore/spirit stone design concepts that you all will use accurately, this is the new mining system we came up with, add these new pickaxes with the exact design which we came up with and provided, etc. Obviously, some of this could be concepts that Jagex did indeed use from a player or fan, but obviously, or it should be obvious to you, Jagex did not take all of this concept art and re-creation of the mining system from the singular vague quote and slight or what be it concept inspiration by a player, into the massive update that has loads of content. If we're being realistic and using common sense though that would be a cool idea, that isn't the case. And one player that made the concept art, mechanics, etc. doesn't constitute for the agreement of the majority. Which is where we come full circle to the conclusion that the vague statement which was, "we want a mining rework" that the majority of people agreed to, isn't literally the rest of that pretty much.
Change isn't going to come to you. Take control of your life.

29-Mar-2019 00:09:44

Vandinite
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2018

Vandinite

Posts: 93Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Therefore, you should understand that they are creating new content. Or using content inspiration from someone of non-majority in the instances where they did so. Therefore the (majority) if you do not want them to be upset from the change they did not originally come to census on, because it is new content and not content that is original to them, you tinker the update, because while they did vaguely want a, "mining rework", they also didn't decide the final content that MADE up that mining rework. Hence why they lost a lot of playerbase due to previous updates, because in the instances where majority of people wanted the updates that applies to, they still didn't get to decide what was in the vague content they suggested. Legit all of this is something you should understand very easily and i'm not sure why you don't. All and all, this is why people complain, King. Furthermore, the spirits don't hold as much value as the ores, and overall, especially QBD has still lost out on a lot of profit margin. Nex as my other example is still effected. That all of which goes on and i suggest research. Change isn't going to come to you. Take control of your life.

29-Mar-2019 00:13:07 - Last edited on 29-Mar-2019 00:14:41 by Vandinite

Kings Abbot

Kings Abbot

Posts: 3,605Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Jagex has been very transparant about the rework, always giving us the details of how it was going to work. Two years ago or so, we gave feedback (mostly negative apparently) and they started over. Last year there were betas for everyone to try the rework, and Jagex begged us for feedback. They tweaked it a bit further based on our feedback and then released it. People knew (or could have known if they really cared) well before the update was released what they were going to get. The rework was never a 'vague' word.

Jagex replaced the ores from drop tables because too much ore was getting in the game that way, and they wanted to let people mine them again as that was and still is the whole point of the Mining skill.

The spirits are basically still ores, you get them for free when you go mine the same amount of ores from a rock. Nobody forces you to sell them.
The Wiki needs a hand, and Bwian's will gladly take the rest of your (carcinogenic) body!

The Answer to the Great Question of Life, the Universe and Everything is...
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29-Mar-2019 12:06:54

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