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Ocularis a Moon& other Musings

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Elf†of†Seren
Nov Gold Premier Club Member 2012

Elf†of†Seren

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Obligatory discussion page.

http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Transcript:Grondaban%27s_stalker_notes

New Dung lore, if anyone hasn't yet made it to the dungeon yet.

~~~~

My big question: Did they kill Grondaban to keep their secrets (that obviously failed), or do you think he's actually alive there, still studying?
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08-Jan-2018 22:04:43 - Last edited on 08-Jan-2018 22:20:41 by Elf†of†Seren

Ptolemy†Dean

Ptolemy†Dean

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That's no moon...

In regards to Grondaban, I really hope he's alright. I like the character and his notes. I was one of those who thought Skaldrun was him, but I guess the new lore doesn't support that anymore. Hopefully the Father doesn't kill him, although I guess death might be preferable to whatever a protostalker can cook up.
"Ptolemos, the friendly, informative Mahjarrat."
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08-Jan-2018 23:57:27

Goldmage162
Oct Member 2009

Goldmage162

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Well, it doesn't technically disprove it, as far as I know. You could make the argument that he is Skaldrun, and perhaps the first Stalker gave him the ability somehow to "see" more things, as skaldrun does.

09-Jan-2018 04:05:44

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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Goldmage162 said:
Well, it doesn't technically disprove it, as far as I know. You could make the argument that he is Skaldrun, and perhaps the first Stalker gave him the ability somehow to "see" more things, as skaldrun does.


Skaldrun observes the happenings of Daemonheim. Just like weíre told Grondabanís soulgazer friend did.

Skaldrun tells us stories of what he saw. Just like the soulgazer told Grondaban.

Skaldrun tells us stories he could not have personally witnessed all of (he was frozen after all). Just like the stalkers can see and tell of what other stalkers witnessed because of their hive mind.

Itís almost as if Skaldrun is linked into the hive mind of the stalkers (at least with the local ones), much like how father wanted to add Grondaban to the hive.

09-Jan-2018 04:53:38

Wahisietel
Oct Gold Premier Club Member 2005

Wahisietel

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Hguoh said:
Goldmage162 said:
Well, it doesn't technically disprove it, as far as I know. You could make the argument that he is Skaldrun, and perhaps the first Stalker gave him the ability somehow to "see" more things, as skaldrun does.


Skaldrun observes the happenings of Daemonheim. Just like weíre told Grondabanís soulgazer friend did.

Skaldrun tells us stories of what he saw. Just like the soulgazer told Grondaban.

Skaldrun tells us stories he could not have personally witnessed all of (he was frozen after all). Just like the stalkers can see and tell of what other stalkers witnessed because of their hive mind.

Itís almost as if Skaldrun is linked into the hive mind of the stalkers (at least with the local ones), much like how father wanted to add Grondaban to the hive.


Problem with that theory is that Grondaban's journal takes place as recently as the Strange Power (despite what the date says...), and Skaldrun was frozen a long time ago.
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09-Jan-2018 13:20:26

AesirWarrior
Nov Member 2017

AesirWarrior

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The timeline is a bit weird. The book's dated 4th age, year 1867, yet almost every event Grondaban witnesses has to take place in the 5th age. Nadir is set in 168 and is before Bilrach captured the Chelon-Mah, and the strange power itself (The Chelon-Mah's death) was in 169. The Fremennik also didn't arrive until after the strange power.

There were some fantheories for a while that the Daemonheim rift warps time, which could explain the odd dates I suppose, but I doubt that's the case.

09-Jan-2018 16:07:23

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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AesirWarrior said:
The timeline is a bit weird. The book's dated 4th age, year 1867, yet almost every event Grondaban witnesses has to take place in the 5th age. Nadir is set in 168 and is before Bilrach captured the Chelon-Mah, and the strange power itself (The Chelon-Mah's death) was in 169. The Fremennik also didn't arrive until after the strange power.

There were some fantheories for a while that the Daemonheim rift warps time, which could explain the odd dates I suppose, but I doubt that's the case.


Itís not just a theory.

The Daemonheim Journal ĎPortal Notesí describes one of the portals on the warped floor showing a view of the Daemonheim fortress before the destruction of Forinthry. The notes were written in Year 1840 of the 4th age by an unknown author (likely Grondaban given the style and date relative to the new lore drop).

In the notes, the author finds a scrap of parchment. This scrap is believed to be the Daemonheim journal of the same name, which contains part of one of the
god letters. Specifically, the one where Guthix describes the nature of his sleep during the 2nd age.

Both the vision and the scrap indicate temporal origins different from that of the author.

Thatís not even getting in to the fact that Ocularis is a moon that can traverse the universe at great speeds and massive enough to warp local gravity. Both are things that can bend the fabric of spacetime and cause the time of those on the moon to pass slower relative to planes with more earthlike gravity and velocity.

09-Jan-2018 16:58:05

AesirWarrior
Nov Member 2017

AesirWarrior

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Time travel is one thing, continually affecting the passage of time in an area is another. For that reason I'd still place it far into the "theory" corner. It's definitely possible, but I personally wouldn't assume that the rift constantly affects Daemonheim like that. Not without further evidence. The implications for Dishonour Among Thieves and Zamorak alone are huge.

09-Jan-2018 17:11:10 - Last edited on 09-Jan-2018 17:11:37 by AesirWarrior

Hguoh
Mar Gold Premier Club Member 2014

Hguoh

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AesirWarrior said:
Time travel is one thing, continually affecting the passage of time in an area is another. For that reason I'd still place it far into the "theory" corner. It's definitely possible, but I personally wouldn't assume that the rift constantly affects Daemonheim like that. Not without further evidence. The implications for Dishonour Among Thieves and Zamorak alone are huge.


Well, thereís also the bit of Bilrach writing notes up to year 1911 of the 4th age before transitioning into the 5th age dates. He would later bring the Ritual Marker from Freneskae at some point prior to year 168 of the 5th age and returned to sacrifice the Chelon-Mah sometime during year 169 of the 5th age.

Yet Grondaban writes of those same events when he perceives it to be only Year 1867 of the 4th age. Now, one of them could be wrong in their perception of time, or something funky could be going on with time and space in Daemonheim. And considering the temporally displaced image and note mentioned above, I favor the latter interpretation. I think that certain portals in the warped floors of Daemonheim can occasionally displace beings in time as well as place to varying and often unpredictable degrees, or they alter the local flow of time such that an individual might arrive somewhere prior to when they left.

Compared to elsewhere in Daemonheim, the location we visit in DAT seems fairly stable and would be less likely to be affected by temporal and spatial variations.

09-Jan-2018 18:24:39 - Last edited on 09-Jan-2018 18:25:07 by Hguoh

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